Carbon Fiber Tube Shroud
I used the Rockwest composites’ carbon fiber for shroud. If you know more cheap carbon fiber tube, please let me know.
http://www.rockwestcomposites.com/browse/carbon-fiber-tubing/filament-wound-carbon-tubing
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Thats a nice design, but its more of an airstripper than a sound deadener.
The interior volume will quiet it down a bit, but the muzzle is 2″ from the exit hole. A lot of blast pressure is going to escape that design. I get the feeling he is trying to keep the length down, and accuracy potential unharmed. The diameter of the tube is doing most of the quieting.
–edit–
Hmm, he might have some baffling between the endcap and threaded fitting. If so, much quieter. 😉
I had confused the endcap with the threaded part.
–end edit–
His mounting ideas are quite similar to what I have drawn up for my S410. His vented support bushing is not needed really. The tube is fully supported by the rear mount and threaded end cap on the barrel. That carbon will have zero flex unless he parks a car on it.
I found very detail works of carbon shroud below site;
Well said RiffRaff, well said…. 🙂
We are all competitive in our own way around here and I am no exception.
Some like to post groups, some like to tell jokes, some share very useful ideas but some just like to display their egos. Everyone has a role here whether they realize it or not. 😉
Good lord, another newcomer that can tell all of us peasants what it’s all REALLY about… Ughh…. 😕
One hole groups at 50 meters is just the baseline for accuracy. We’re not shooting rimfire here. 😉 If anything though one of my joys from shooting air rifles is the challenge you can get in a relatively short space. If you want to go have fun with a large caliber centerfire you have to find a couple miles of open space to shoot safely. Here you can have a few of the environmental problems of long range shooting all in a nice tidy ~150 meter package. No its not a substitute, but its still a lot of fun.
Yes the design on Talon is for 12″ barrels. A 18 or 24″ barrel would necessitate a different design, but thats the joy of DIY: I can build each thing to function perfectly on every rifle. Same reason why the tail piece is fitted to my specific gun.
“PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 1:04 pm Post subject:
Ive casually said before I have the most accurate pellet-slinging condor here at 50 yards, but thats only because I do not have paper between the pellet holes. I’m sure some can shoot better. ”
Am I detecting a hint of competitiveness here. 😛 😉 Never get comfortable and complacent in your own capabilities. Just because you may be the best, doesn’t mean you’re good enough. There is always technology to push forward, and thats accomplished through dissatisfaction. THAT is the fun in this game. 😀
All I can say to that is, I have no accuracy issues at all. But then I have a bit over 4 years with this gun, and it took a good 2 years to get it set the way I could rely on.
Ive casually said before I have the most accurate pellet-slinging condor here at 50 yards, but thats only because I do not have paper between the pellet holes. I’m sure some can shoot better.
Turbulence doesnt seem to be a factor at all for me, but I take considerable attention to centering the shroud to the bore.
That design of yours, is for 12″ barrels correct? You can not get away with that with the longer barrels most of us shoot. My Condor uses a 10″ tube, with 3.5″ of baffles in the end. It puts benjis on target each and every time, love that setup. 😉
The little example I posted the pic of, is now on my signature rifle.
“That section” is hollow on my design, but I didn’t want to cross drill it because your potential to create uneven air evacuation and turbulence ahead of the round is far too high. Unlike with supersonic designs where you’re ahead of the wave, here it is critical to evenly strip turbulence off the round. You didn’t gain that much volume on me either. 😉 Drilling out the sides of mine would add maybe 3 cubic centimeters of volume to my shroud. That is why I pushed the “cap” back closer to the muzzle. Having to travel all the way down that stock shroud being buffeted isn’t good for accuracy. A design like this, if done properly, can improve accuracy above stock.
I understood your concept, and your picture shows what you mean sort of.
2 questions:
1 Why do you not increase the volume of the section that is inserted into the frame? Something like this
Only the outer is carbon on this one. Backyard friendly and tank-dump proven. 😉
Other full length shrouds I use have only an aluminum adapter attaching the tube section to the frame. Very snug fit as you describe.
2 What layup did you use to build such a thing? I can see the 3k woven outer on the tube section, buit its unclear if you created a baffled core, or it its just a can.
I’ve seen a tank dump peel an aluminum tube shroud open like a banana.. Feel free to take your chances with cheap carbon. 😛 You are correct though you can design a shroud such that it is far more tolerant of a tank dump.
Anyway as requested an image:
That is what I meant by extending it into the existing front of the shroud on the Talon SS. Before you ask the ridge visible is to fit an O-ring to prevent any air leak IF necessary, (I found if you fit it properly its not)
*edit*
I don’t know if this is “breaking the rules” because I only have two posts, but for DIYers who don’t have the tools, I can supply easy to use splices and end caps so people can make their own shrouds. Just add a tube of whatever material you prefer.
What Riff said. Pics please. 😀
First of all its shit, not sh*t.
Second, good first post but you are over-engineering tubes suitable for shroud work.
Tank dump will not blow up your shroud unless you constructed it extremely poorly. I agree pultruded is NOT the way to go.
A picture of your layup would definitely help most of the readers understand what your saying.
Third, welcome to TAG.
As someone who spends a fair bit of time working with composites what you want aren’t the sh*t pultruded tubes, or even the 90% longitudinal. You want about 80% longitudinal under a seamless cloth sleeve thats roll wrapped.
Also as far as needing the carbon “thick” I’d say what you want is your first “dampers” to start, if you’re running an SS, deep inside the stock shroud so you don’t need the volume in the carbon tube to have to do all the work. Both quality carbon and aluminum have excellent KE transfer meaning both will be “loud” if you put the full 3K PSI dump into them straight off because quality tubes of either will have no problem transferring the energy to their outer surface. Do I need to shoot a picture of what I mean, or did I describe it reasonably well?
As far as practicality goes there is no doubt that alu. is cheaper, but its heavier and lacks the “sex” of carbon. That said I suspect a tank dump into a cheap sh*t carbon shroud will be infinitely more exciting than an aluminum shroud. It’ll also make you a lot less pretty. THAT is why I’d argue quality carbon work is important here.
arent fishing poles typically tapered (thicker in one end vs the other) ?
maybe its the pure carbon tubes i tried with that is not as good as aluminum or carbon with a alu or fiberglass inside…composite materials like be it carbon with fiberglass or a steel tube with brass insert…two materials of different mass will dampen much better than a single
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whats up yall? okay look, im new to this forum, and i admit that i dont have a talon, although i did have a condor in .22 a few years back. the reason that i signed up for this site is because so far, after a couple of weeks of searching online for this topic, you guys appear to be about the only ones who seem to know exactly what you are talking about.
i have a hammer, in .510, and i am at my wits end why they would design a hunting rifle with a shroud that can crack if its tipped over or knocks something in the field. i live in oregon, so theres trees and greenery so thick in the woods that theres no way that you COULDNT hit something with the barrel. i admit, maybe im being paranoid. maybe it doesnt break that easily. at the same time, 4500 psi is a lot of pressure, and i 100% believe it could banana peel an aluminum shroud, or even a poorly made carbon fiber one.
sorry, my point to this is, ive been turning over in my head the idea of replacing the shroud with something that wouldnt crack on one end or get a notch in it from a branch that i didnt see, and end up blowing shrapnel through my head. best case scenario, probably. i know that i could be possibly playing russian roulette here, almost literally, so i defer to your expertise on this topic.
if i were to replace the factory carbon fiber shroud, what should i do it with? i am quite capable of fabrication, and the work that this would entail, please dont misunderstand me. its the specs and capabilities of the materials that im questioning. any help would be appreciated, and i thank you all for humoring me on this.