Condor Convertible from .22 to .177SS
Changing from .22 x 24″ Condor to .177 x 12″ Condor with the Top Down.
There are ways around the issue. For the NEW .177 Condor the valve seating spring is different. That’s a job taking the valve out of the tank to change it. And another problem to change back. Another issue is the Condor HiFlo valve could be changed to the Talon valve stem that is slightly less in inner diameter. I didn’t find that necessary either. Thirdly, The Condor has an added Hammer weight to drive the HiFlo valve open further. With swapping to a .177 x 12″ barrel, I had problems with way too much air release. Strangely the only tank dump I had was with CO2 and loose fitting Daisy FN pellets. Eventually I learned to push them in the barrel further.
So, I bought the .177 x 12″ barrel not knowing all the problems mentioned above and went my own way to compensate so I could still use the same Condor .22 Valve and Tank.
Without buying a new tank, there are other ways to cut the air volume for a .177 barrel. Now my idea was to have my powerful .22 and a .177 x 12″ SS (super Silent) back yard plinker.
OK, 1st the Hammer can be reconfigured to drive the valve a little less open. With some help from Pabs, my thoughts are that removing the weight also reduces the Hammer Spring tension and I didn’t want to make that much a change so instead I placed the hammer weight in front of the spring. The fit isn’t exactly the same so it added about 2 1/2 turns of spring tension. So, I call it my “Enlightened Hammer Arrangement” = Less Hammer weight but approximate same distance of travel.
Hey, it worked for me and I didn’t get any tank dumps but did get a higher than expected velocity out of a 12″ .177 barrel.
2nd, It wasn’t very quiet. There was more air escaping than necessary. So, I did a lousy job of venting the front .177 barrel bushing. Cheep half-ass drill stand for a drill press just can’t drill straight. You have to avoid drilling through the barrel set screw holes and the barrel mounting set screw holes. So you get more holes on one side than the other but that’s OK. Now with the vented bushing instead of hearing a whoosh of air, the sound changed! Now I didn’t hear any whoosh but instead an annoying PING. Sounds tinny to me but the Ping doesn’t carry down range as much and can be dealt with by De-Pinging or a good Hammer Slap Mod from Tony266.
3rd, De-Ping’n the ding dang thing. Several ways work ie Tony’s Hammer Slap Mod is a proven, and then there’s the possibleity of rubber wedges on top and bottom of the tank between the tank and the frame may also help. I’ve forgotten who came up with that but it sounds good. HOWEVER, 2 people have told me about using an o-ring between the Top Hat and the brass valve guide. Edward says it increases shot count and now PowderBurner comes along and PROVES the 0-ring to not only increase shot count but allows for using lower PSI and achieving super accuracy and range with the lighter pellets. This is where things begin to fit together. Ideas like Tony’s proven hammer slap mod, Rubber wedges like used on some bows to dampen vibration, vinyl tubing used in other air rifle tanks and cylingers, and now to my surprise, an 0-ring behind the Top Hat that has the added benefit of slightly reducing PING.
So, the answer to many questions is “Yes” there is a Christmas! You don’t have to buy a new tank to swap in a .177 barrel and if you’re going for a fairly silent backyard .177 12″ barrel, you get the bonus early Christmas present of it being darned accurate at lower velocities and for a fairly good distance. Per PowderBurner’s postings I learned to use well under 2000 PSI for the lighter .22 and .177 pellets.
But, I can’t stay put very long. As soon as I got my .177 x 12″ working good I swapped back to .22 x 24″ to add on an E-TaC REG and work my way back up to 100 yard shooting. From the looks of it I should be able to tone done the volume of air from the Regulator to make use of the o-ring mod talked about by Edward and written up so well be PowderBurner.
Damn, I LOVE MY CONDOR CONVERTIBLE (High Power .22 x 24″ and Condor SS Quiet .177 x 12″ BackYard Snipper
Please check the “I AGREE” box before you continue.
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Viewing 14 replies - 1 through 14 (of 14 total)
Lurker
Thnx M8 will do.
I dont think I have the problem yet but my TSS is fricken loud az, at the rifle. Will be eventually looking at Hushing it down some. After enough research will probably try to make a small baffle. After that I’m sure the loud gun problems will rare their ugly heads.
Cheers :thumb:
Would be cool to see some links for the above mentioned Hammer slap & Top Hat o-ring damper.
Techmod,
Try search for PING and you’ll find several links that talk about ways to De-Ping which should help take care of Hammer Slap. Talon Tunes, Tony has a real good Hammer slap mod.
Also, for Top Hat O-Ring mod, it was an old topic recently brought back to light with a lot of targets and great LOW power accuracy by PowderBurner. Check most of the topics originated by PowderBurner.
Hey Just buy a Talon SS
Would be cool to see some links for the above mentioned Hammer slap & Top Hat o-ring damper.
I originally had the Condor then realized that it was not going to be quiet enough for back yard plinking. However just recently I removed the Hammer spacer to find the spring is the exact same part as used in the Talon SS. I thought that since it had been used, it may have compressed some. To my surprise just removing the spacer seemed to work and there was no play with a sligt load on the hammer exactly like the Talon SS. A few test shots with different power wheel settings and the un-modified Condor Hi-Flo tank revealed that the power was significantly lower, however still openeing the Hi-Flo enough to shoot.
I don’t have my Chrony yet so I shoot fresh 4×2 and measure penetration 😮 . The .22 15.4grain dome and Barracuda 22grain were used 3000psi start. Initial shots with PW 0-2 produced approx 1/4-1/2″ average at 2 feet range. PW 12-12.5 produced 1-1/4 to 1-1/2″ approx at 24″ range. The heavier pellets generally penetrated a little more. Thats alot of punch and variation. This setup was also quiet with a standard Condor at low PW settings. I knew that this lowered the power but this would work well with a 12″ barrel, likely overpower it at higher PW settings.
I was thinking to myself this aint grunty enough to be a Condor .22 😈 So I put the spacer 19.0 grams back in and screwed the PW to 12 and blew right through the 4×2 😀 & I was happy again. I am also testing a Talon SS .177, the rifle is not loud in standard config DOWN RANGE. However without modification the actual shooter gets a crap load of noise for every shot. But I also have been testing the .177 in the 4×2, I havn’t been able to blow right through yet! Pellets used are 7.5grain domes and TS-10 10.49 grain. The TS-10’s seem nice on the range have shot to 70 yards with good accuracy. The goal with the TSS is to get as much power as possible with PW on high settings and be able to make it quiet on low PW settings.
If you can get this adjustment you can pretty much use any weight pellets, for purpose.
Thats a big post for me on a Wednesday morning 🙄
and… where is the picture of your baby??????
BTW, where the heck “I AGREE” box? LOL.
Thanks dvu0704. I AGREE 😎
…. .. …. .. …. .. …. ..
Oh, and my “I AGREE” box is where they
all belong…IN THE SHIT CAN ❗
Nice write-up LURKER, you’re daman.
BTW, where the heck “I AGREE” box? LOL.
Hold Over,
Those who appreciate and use good hardware have been the driving force that keep tinker’s developing and improving the things we desire. In a free market society most things keep improving and/or becoming more affordable.
When only one opinion is acceptable or one person determines what everyone’s desires should be, there will no longer be innovation.
Let us know how it works out.
I called airforce and they said they could set up a HP tank for 177 by ajusting the spring in the valve .
I said but I still want to use the .22
they said it wont hurt the velocity much .
(and the check is in the mail too)
So I figured the best way for myself to shoot rather than tinker was to just get a new 177 dedicated tank.
Sounds good and only time will tell.
Great info’ Lurk’ 😎
Thanks PB,
I was torn between .22 & .177 x 12″ for an SS conversion. But, I figured my best chance for a quiet yard rifle would be the .177. At the time I didn’t know it couldn’t be done 🙄 I’ve always enjoyed making things work in an unconventional way.
Now if someone comes up with a similar .22SS I would like to here them side by side.
But, if they did similar to what I did, not all is lost. They don’t have to buy a different tank or valve or valve spring. And if they start with your o-ring mod and lower PSI, Maybe they won’t have to use the “LURKER #1 Enlightened Hammer Arrangement”. But. The option is available if they check the box for “I AGREE” not to hold Lurker #1 responsable before they continue. 😆 😆
PLEASE: Pictures & Targets !!!!!!!
:popcorn:
Nicely written Lurker,
i would like to see a test using the stock condor hammer arrangement, with the stock condor tank & valve, and use the oring to control fps. in the 12” .177 set up on air .
I think the oring would keep the tank from dumping. with a very low top hat setting. and this would lower your fps down.
I have thought about getting a .177 for the condor but then i would have to buy a crap load of .177 pellets, so really i should stay with .22, and maybe get a 12” .but it would be fun to play with .177 in the condor .
I really like the idea of having a super short condor to shoot,way easier to handle in tight places. besides i think the SS is cool looking.
Viewing 14 replies - 1 through 14 (of 14 total)
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Got a TT 12″ x .177 from Tony. What a beautiful thing
😎 😎
Miserable weather and sicker than a dog for several weeks but finally got to shoot 30 rounds at a Target.
Started with a bargain 300 daisy pellets for $2.00 What a bargain 10shots at 35yards and only 4 hit the target sheet. Group of 14+ inches. 👿
Enough of that, out come the
10.6 grain Kodaks. 10 shots 1″ group. 7 of them were in a 1/2″ line. I think this new TT barrel will give me sub 1/2″ groups at 35+ yards when I have a chance to dial me in.
BTW, PSI around 2300, Power Wheel 5 3/4 turns, hammer spacer in front of spring (my enlightened hammer arrangement), o-ring on valve pin, top hat adjusted for no play at breech latch. 10.6 Kodak avg. 910 FPS.