Leyla in .25 caliber..too much weight to do well?
Gather ’round children and let’s talk about velocity and such.
My first thought about a .25 Leyla was “Wow…the worlds smallest quality bullpup in the largest caliber offered by the maker! Hmmm…new, untried, untested, big pellet, small air supply, unknown valve/regulator configuration…hmmmm.”
To my knowledge, there are but three prime variables in pellet speed and foot pounds of energy.
First, the function of the valve/regulator is to give adequate feet per second and foot pounds of energy, but it does so at the cost of air usage/shot count. (Ed says 20 shots, ok for such a tiny gun.)
Second, barrel length is a variable that will increase velocity by roughly 50 fps per inch of barrel added. (Leyla = 12″ barrel, same as the Talon SS)
The last variable is pellet weight. Ed is designing the Leyla .25 around the JSB 25.4 gr. pellet, and therein lies our ability to initially affect the velocity we get from the Leyla .25 and not adjust or modify anything on or in the gun.
Here are some viable .25 caliber options:
Beeman Silver Ace…a 21 gr. domed pellet, standard skirt, and has what appears to be “gas rings” cut around the head of the pellet. (180 ct) It’s a 4.4 grain weight drop from the JSB.
H & N Field Target Trophy…a domed 19 grain pellet. ((200 ct)) Looks good in the box, with a 6.4 grain weight loss .
Pylarm (BSA) a semi-dome head, standard skirt, coming in at 18.6 grains. (200 ct) I have no experience with these, and don’t know availability in the U.S. but the lads in the Motherland should be able to give us some input. It gives us 6.8 gr weight reduction. I have one full tin in hand for testing.
Lastly, Beeman Laser pellets, 18 gr. (180 ct) a full 7.4 grain weight loss, and a respectable weight. Like the Pylarm, they have a semi-dome head, and regular skirt.
Now…when I get my .25 Leyla, I paid in full, so I should get a few days head start on the rest of the herd in the U.S. I will grab my chrony and do some fps/fpe testing and post the results. Accuracy may/may not reflect reality…remember I’m 71 with not so good eyes, but I can use a bench rest, so I hope I can give some reasonable idea of whether any of these will tend to “fly” on us.
I’m assuming that a 3 mm increase in .25 head diameter over a .22 (6.35 -5.5mm) will make any appreciable difference in pellet speed.
In closing, these are top quality pellets at a reasonable price. They will absolutely increase the velocity. By how much? I don’t know. But Sir Issac Newton says it will increase, and I believe him.
Perhaps Ed might share some information on the valve/regulator to be used in the new Leyla…same? new? modified? different per caliber?
Now, if anyone knows how to calculate velocity increase, per each one grain weight reduction, that would be most interesting. I don’t have those skills.
Thoughts….someone out there is bound to be smarter than me on this subject!!!
Hoot:
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Why am I standing in flames????
Hoot:
I can’t understand half of what you guys are talking about. How can a formula NOT have numbers? That’s how come I got into a fist fight with my algebra teacher, and got tossed out of high school in my freshman year back in ’58! (right after I punched her upper plate out, that fat old bitch kicked me right in the balls…in front of the whole class!!!)
Kyzer Sores…that “parabola” you so smart-ass tossed into your dialog, has nothing to do with air guns…that’s that Liberian, diarrhea-causing, gum disease from Africa everyone’s dying from in Texas!!! Nice try…but don’t use big words, unless you know what they mean!
Kee-ripe!….Phd’s, African gum diseases, physic “formulas”, “heat energy”…sometimes I don’t know why I even try to hold an intelligent discussion on this forum.
Fuggit…I’m signing off and going down to eat Tex-Mex at Acapulco’s restaurant…it’s buck Margarita night!!! At least I speak some Mexican…
Hoot:
Personally I hated physics at school.. all the hot girls were in the art classes so that’s where I spent my time..
Here Hoot, let me dumb it all down for you with a flow diagram.. 
This is from a earlier post of :hoot:
I have my third 3 X 9-42 UTG 30mm Bugbuster scope waiting for my Leyla/Lelya .25 caliber.
I have had really good results in the 3 to 9X, and 4 to 12X UTG range scopes in the past. They have always been bright and clear, with plenty of magnification for the ranges I “humanely relocate” the critters in my yard. They have held their “zero” without fail.
Hoot:
I must have missed his post on that. No need to apologize. Thank you kindly for letting me know about the UTG scopes.
As for Uncle Hoot’s left nut, I’m sure someone is going to invent a miniature electric pump that will allow him to hook up a tiny foster fitting to his left nut. No need for manual pump anymore :hoot:
Reason why I asked him about his soon to be Russian girlfriend(Lelya) is just to get him all wound up about what he is going to do with her. Dirty old fart!!!
Did you know Uncle Hoot used to be an Olympic judge. He would only have one sign card that he throws up. Its got a big number 10 written on it. Here Uncle Hoot judging an Olympic event.
Dear Sand-Bag,.
I do indeed, have, as we speak, a 3 X 9 Bugbuster ready to be mounted on Leyla when she arrives.
Currently I’m in pre-production talks for “ Leyla Splintering Gut Buster Hollow Point Swaged Slugs.” in weights which will maximize the Leyla’s reduced power levels, but provide super high velocity kinetic energy upon impact! The slug’s hollow points will be packed solid with a freeze dried, all natural bullshit, shaped-charge, poly pointed tip!
They won’t be cheap, but I can guarantee I’ll be the talk of the woods from the Hot Springs waste water treatment plant, all the way down to the inlet at Frog Lick Creek, just South of Toad Suck Road!
I’ll share my results as they become available…film may be possible! Stay tuned….
Uncle Hoot:
sorry for Uncle Hoots slow response to your post but sometimes he gets caught up with his left nut Pump and forgets to check in on his minions. Or he’s forgot his password again and waiting for a new one :hoot:
This is from a earlier post of :hoot:
I have my third 3 X 9-42 UTG 30mm Bugbuster scope waiting for my Leyla/Lelya .25 caliber.
I have had really good results in the 3 to 9X, and 4 to 12X UTG range scopes in the past. They have always been bright and clear, with plenty of magnification for the ranges I “humanely relocate” the critters in my yard. They have held their “zero” without fail.
Hoot:
Uncle Hoot
Which scope are you planning to mount on your .25 Lelya?
Ed promised me he’d send “…some extras to make up for Hoot’s waiting!”
With my luck it will be a liter jar of “Ed Piss”!!!!
That’s the way my luck has been running lately.
Hoot:
PS: I remember your wife from high school. I remember telling my friends “I found a 50 cent piece last night, but lost her address!!!” Fortunately for me she was in my study hall class, and I recognized the smell of her underwear. What drew my attention to her were the flies… :rofl: :butkick: :rofl: :butkick: :rofl: :butkick: :rofl: :butkick:
PS PS: Wait one minute…I’m too old to have seen your wife. Let’s make it your grandmother instead!!!!
While your idea is more Queer than you are, I certainly encourage new thinking about such things!
My Uber-Leyla is currently in the hands of skilled craftsmen in a foreign country. However, with my luck he’s a Muslim radical with Ebola, and will piss on the trigger prior to sending it to me. sigh…. Not to fear, I’ll wipe it down good, and clean it before I fire it.
Cosmetically, I’m thinking about having someone paint orange, red and yellow flames on the side of the shroud…right at the muzzle!!! I might even put a nick name on the stock. I’ve been thinking about “SUPERFLY” after the 1070’s movie of the same name, ’cause he also was Black, bad, and never missed when he shot. (Did he really die after being run over by a beer truck carrying Malt ’40s in Oakland in 1983??? I vaguely remember reading that on the ‘net a few years ago.)
Just a few thoughts for when Leyla arrives. Things will pick up here when the mods start coming through.
Hoot:
Hey, I’m not queer! One time for a lot of money doesn’t make me queer. And it was Robert Redford for pete’s sake! You try saying no to those baby blues! I think you should name your new gun “Shaft.” And don’t be goofy, Ed’s not an Islamic radical who will piss on your trigger. He’ll pee on your cheek peice.
While your idea is more Queer than you are, I certainly encourage new thinking about such things!
My Uber-Leyla is currently in the hands of skilled craftsmen in a foreign country. However, with my luck he’s a Muslim radical with Ebola, and will piss on the trigger prior to sending it to me. sigh…. Not to fear, I’ll wipe it down good, and clean it before I fire it.
Cosmetically, I’m thinking about having someone paint orange, red and yellow flames on the side of the shroud…right at the muzzle!!! I might even put a nick name on the stock. I’ve been thinking about “SUPERFLY” after the 1070’s movie of the same name, ’cause he also was Black, bad, and never missed when he shot. (Did he really die after being run over by a beer truck carrying Malt ’40s in Oakland in 1983??? I vaguely remember reading that on the ‘net a few years ago.)
Just a few thoughts for when Leyla arrives. Things will pick up here when the mods start coming through.
Hoot:
Hoot, why don’t you go with the 1gr Beeman cleaning pellets in the Lelya and then when they turn around to see who hit them with a pillow, use the Matador for forehead shots?
My Dearest and Venerable Uncle Hoot :hoot:
why don’t you just get out of trouble and buy a Cricket Compact.
Very short (62 cm) but FULL SPECIFICATIONS 😀
(The Lelya with additional LDC will be much longer)
Ok I know, supposedly they are no longer in production but has this been confirmed?
(IMHO so much more gun for only little additional length)
ATB 😀
Parabola is the shape of your skull ergo it does have something to do with airguns.
Hoot: high school yearbook photo 😈
Hoot:
Son’s a Bitches!!!
I didn’t LITERALLY mean what I said!
I can’t understand half of what you guys are talking about. How can a formula NOT have numbers? That’s how come I got into a fist fight with my algebra teacher, and got tossed out of high school in my freshman year back in ’58! (right after I punched her upper plate out, that fat old bitch kicked me right in the balls…in front of the whole class!!!)
Kyzer Sores…that “parabola” you so smart-ass tossed into your dialog, has nothing to do with air guns…that’s that Liberian, diarrhea-causing, gum disease from Africa everyone’s dying from in Texas!!! Nice try…but don’t use big words, unless you know what they mean!
Kee-ripe!….Phd’s, African gum diseases, physic “formulas”, “heat energy”…sometimes I don’t know why I even try to hold an intelligent discussion on this forum.
Fuggit…I’m signing off and going down to eat Tex-Mex at Acapulco’s restaurant…it’s buck Margarita night!!! At least I speak some Mexican…
Hoot:
Hoot is not asking if 30 ft pounds is enough energy he’s discussing the parabola or trajectory of the pellet due to it’s heavier weight and slower muzzle velocity. That is why he may be looking for a solution with the lighter pellet. The 25.39 JSB will travel 730 fps in the Leyla. If zeroed at 50 yards it will drop 21.39 inches at 100 yards. The .20 Leyla will push a 13.73 pellet 790 fps and it will drop 19.3 inches at 100 yards if zeroed at 50. On the other hand using the formula and real world chrony numbers I know that a 18.3 grain 25 cal will reach 840 fps in the same gun pushing a 25.39 pellet 730, but because of this pellets poor BC it will drop 22.6 inches in the same gun zeroed at 50 yards. So for several reasons like BC, speed and skirt size the lighter pellet may not be the solution Hoot is looking for. Having said that we see that the .20 is slightly flatter but not so much that it is a world of difference. 2 inches of elevation is something but it can be adjusted for. I think the best solution if Hoot wants to use the .25 Leyla for long range sniping is to get a scope with Mrad adjustments instead of MOA. This will mean less spins on the turret and quicker to zero for the next shot. For me I don’t like to dope more than 6 inches of drop with hold over because for most reticles this much holdover is makes it hard to dope wind.
So in conclusion the .25 Leyla will use more air but it will be just as shootable as a smaller caliber. So decide whats more important I guess.
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I think it’s from the old saying, you know what burns my Ass? A flame about this high. :2cents: