Need help on regulator
Well Ive hit 2000 shots so I decided to break down my Edgun 22 long
And adjust down regulator slightly. Everything disassembled fine. Got down to reg and it was loosely screwed together. So I started taking it apart. Removed lock screw top piece to expose washer pack inside. Needless to say I had it tipped And all the washer came sliding out onto towel. Washers stack stayed slightly in order but first and last few flipped around. I’ve watched Oldgoats video and can see he also has total of 12 washers and they look to be stacked in pairs. My stack looked to be organized a bit differently so I reassembled as best I thought it should be. Needless to say kept stock 130 bar set to make sure I had stack right. It’s locked down to 400 fps. HST won’t get it past 450.
I need to know order/orientation of washer stack please.
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Very true Endo. What Im looking for now is most stable fps shot string from start to finish and whatever this gun settles at will do for me.
Ive done accuracy test groups at a variety of fps from 890s to 930s at 100yds and honestly its so close I cant pick a definite winning speed at this point.
Demp, you are right that you are heading to the correct direction – CLOCKWISE – to reduce reg pressure. The hump at the end can be easily taken care of by reducing just a little more reg pressure or slightly increase HST. You have enough shot counts (more than 100) so you can afford to “waste” some air. 🙂
Regards,
Endo
finally got some time to get back into reg adjustment. So I already have reg screw turned counter clockwise 5/16 from stock.Ive been fighting this spike to 950s at end and say to myself lets turn it to half from stock and run the chrony.Im looking at screw and thinking it looks like it is closer to coming out than going in so I grab my depth gauge and sure as shit it is. I turn back to stock setting,take a measurement then back it out to verify and it is threaded normally,the locking screw is reverse threaded only,Reg is tapped reverse thread for lock screw about 6 threads down then 1/8″ gap then standard threads start. GREAT!!! Ive been adjusting wrong way. So back to stock set then 1/4 turn CLOCKWISE which moves screw into reg closer to valve stack,reassemble,charge,reduce HST 1 full turn and run it.Adjust HST to plateau. First run 903 average,4-5 SD,11 ES all the way to shot 102,then a slow climb to 920 (shot 110)then back down to 903 by shot 118 then drop off. Now the shot count is back up and the spike is greatly reduced.Im heading in the right direction now.
OG. I will go farther down. I’m enjoying tinkering with this and am at point where I can field strip/reassemble blindfolded in under 10 min :-).
What has been your experience with amount turned off reg marked at 130(I’m assuming its 130 and not 150) bar. I started with mark at 12 oclock and farthest I turned back was to about 8:30. That gave me a good start fps in the 890s but the spike at end around 110-115ish bar on gun is driving me crazy. I backed down HST during spike so I
was in 890s, refilled then new string started out in the 840s. Arrrgh!!
I’m going to back down reg to 7 o’clock and try that. 🙂
Also gun delivered with HST 6 turns in. It’s currently 6 1/8 in now. I see most are around 2.5 in only
Demp, if you turned the reg in/down and still got an upward spike at the end, you either didn’t turn it down far enough or you didn’t have enough HST. Or both. After you turned the reg down, you should have turned the HST out 2 turns and then turned it in until you got the max fps and went from there.
You are looking for a consistent shot string without a spike at the end. The HST and reg work in unison. When you turn the reg down, back of on the HST and then slowly increase it until you get the max fps. If the max HST adjustment won’t hold the same speeds without a spike at the end, you need to turn the reg down a little more. If you get a spike at the end, the reg is still to high.
The R2.5 and R3 air valve/regulator assemblys are the same for all of the Matadors. Supposedly, a longer barrel will give a 4fps increase for each inch of length.
A properly adjusted Matador will give a very flat shot string until if comes off of the regulator. Once it comes off of the reg, the speed will start dropping.
There are a lot of topics here on the subject that will help you..
I’m shooting 18s as well. My Atlas Bipod came in today so I mounted my weaver rail and bipod to stock. I’ll be able to bench rest gun better now for tighter group comparison.
Demp, sorry to not directly reply on your last update, but I think this is maybe interesting for you and sure for OG..
OG, you tell you like the speeds of 880-890 and I keep telling mine is best at 937fps..
Well, now I think I know why.. 🙂
I shoot 16 grainers, you shoot 18 grainers! 🙂
tadaaaaa!
Update.Been playing with this reg adjustment about a dozen times so far . Well turning the reg in counter clockwise and reducing HST has resulted in a bigger spike at the end before dropping off. Reg turned in 5/16 turn total starting fps at 890. Good for about 50 shots solid SD of 3 fps with ES of 9 then it climbs slowly to low 900s with similar spread until around shot 70 then it starts to ramp up steadily over next 18-20 shots to peak of 950 then starts dropping over next 10 shots to 890 then drops off. When I start turning reg back to original set a 1/16 at a time, the start fps raises incrementally with similar spreads. The shot count raises slightly and the spike at end comes on a little later with less peak fps.
Currently back at stock reg setting(marked 130,pretty sure that’s a 3 and not a 5). Going to tweak HST a bit more but now it starts at 923fps, SD of 4 with 10 ES. Around shot 93 it starts a slow rise to 933 peak at shot 102 then back to 923 by shot 108-110 then drops off.
I don’t know if it’s a characteristic of the 22 long version or my particular reg.
Any other 22 long owners getting fps spread like mine?
Oldgoat,any thoughts? Maybe go other way with reg 1/16 ???
FYI,I do 20 shot groups at 100 yds with each speed in appx 10fps increments (shot over chrony) in 5-12 mph rt to lt wind. All groups consistently averaged appx 1.75″ tall by 3.5″ wide off a table, Caldwell bag upfront ,fingers under stock in back.
Thanks. I did clean and lube the washer stack. R&I of reg is less thAn a 10 min job total. Add in another 10 min for refill and it’s done. I figured out you don’t need to remove front plug. Just degass completely and use a small pair of slip joint pliers and grab back of reg in the two opposing flat spots and gently pull out. When reinstalling you’ll get reg in to about last 1/2″ then push valve to burp tank and it goes rest of way easier.I am definitely one of the picky OCD types so I will get it as perfect as it can be. Ran out of air last night so quick trip to scuba shop and I’ll be back at it.
Threads are reversed so counter clockwise moves reg screw in towards washer stack thus reducing air flow correct.
Demp, it is fun to adjust reg and HST as Tedd said. I think if you want to reduce speed, you need to turn the reg clockwise to reduce pressure. The hump at the end of the string should be taken care of by reducing reg a little bit. I don’t know if this could help, I also cleaned and lubed the washers.
Regards,
Endo
I have found that 18.1 JSBs shoot best at 880-890 fps. I get the best 100 yard accuracy at that speed. On a windless day, speeds up to 925 are still OK but, if there is any wind, the higher speed pellets are affected more than the lower speeds. The higher speeds have more wind drift and fliers. If you are happy with 906, just refill at around 100 shots and smile!
Otherwise, you need to turn the reg down around 1/16 turn counter clockwise, turn the HST screw out 2 turns and then slowly turn it back in and see where the max fps is. 906 is real close to 890, it won’t take much to turn the reg down to 890.
You probably won’t get it set exactly right the first try. Most of the guys that get into the reg are real picky and don’t mind going back in a couple of times!
Myself, I think that adjusting the reg and HST is fun!
when I pulled reg out and went to loosen lock screw the whole top cap started unscrewing.I realized the entire unit was very loosely put together,so I figured I would look inside at everything. OOPS. Common sense told me how it should have gone together but the cluster on table had two of the dinner plate stacks with an additional plate in middle.. Your dinner plate example is excellent. so my stack looked like () () ()) (() () instead of
() () () () () () .. My strings have been odd lately. Some from fill to 100 bar have been nice solid 906 with max 10fps spread. Others will start out at 906 then around shot 95-100(Edgun gauge reads 100 bar) start to slowly climb and peak around 945 at shot 115 then start back down.
Do I need to crank down reg still
Damn you Demp! It took me over an hour uploading the pic, trying to link to it, write my reply up and when I finally post it, I see that you have figured it out!
I REALLY planed on getting to bed early tonight! 😆
Well, I am not really sure what you talking about when you say “lock screw”. The only lock screw in the air valve/reg assembly is the lock screw over the reg pressure setting screw. Taking that lock screw off won’t allow the 12 cup washers to fall out. I think that you are saying that you took the reg’s internals out. You don’t need to do that to adjust the reg’s pressure.
Photobucket is acting goofy tonight and I couldn’t get a link to my pic of the washer stack. The cup washers are in 6 pairs as shipped from Ed. In each pair, the raised edges touch each other. Think of 2 dinner plates, one flipped 180 degrees and set on the other one. Each pair is then slid on the reg’s “bobbin”. If you put the cup washers back on is any other combination, the reg can’t work properly.
Sorry if I am not clear on my explanation. A picture IS worth a thousand words!
If you have the cup washers assembled correctly, you turned the reg adjusting screw way too much counter clockwise. IIRC, your gun was shooting at 906. The reg should only have needed around 1/16, or so, turns counter clockwise to get you to 890.
OK, I found a half assed way to show the cup washer stack. This is what you need. ALL Matador reg internals look like that.
You either don’t have the cup washer stack right or you moved the reg adjuster too far.
Don’t feel too bad, we’ve all had those “OH SHIT” moments!
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I knew you will figure that out sooner or later… 😀
If you are using it for hunting, higher power might be useful.
As far as I can tell, my Matador doesn’t picky on speed neither, 880-920 fps range with 18.1 g JSB shoots well at 50 yds. Or my shooting skill cannot tell the difference if there is any.
Keep us posted…
Regards,
Endo