Question for the barrel guru’s and/or the CO2 folks
My talons are 100% CO2 and this question is centered around barrel ‘stability’. The following is for a short range, off hand shooter in a Talon frame.
When using the 12″ .177 or .22 barrel I get very good results after the first 5-8 shots. Doesn’t surprise me that it take 8 shots or so for the barrel to stop cooling down enough per shot to have a major impact on accuracy. This is normal with all my co2 guns but most only need 3-5 shots before they settle down.
After this, if I shoot at a constant rate I’m good. A little to fast and I get the shot gun effect, if I slow down or take a break I gotta be careful of the shots going high (or left on one of them, odd).
So this is all normal. Question is, if I take an 18″ barrel (much thicker) and have it milled down appropriately, do you think it would be LESS prone small variations in shot timing? I figure the heavier barrel’s attributes would change at a slower rate…
Asking because I am going to actually cut one of the barrels down to about 9.5 inches and do my endcap/internal baffle/bushing combo where the baffle system will support the barrel behind the forward grub screw location. Those grubs will become support for the baffle, the barrel will be grub screwed to the baffle inside the frame and I’m trying to decide which barrel to cut down.
Here is an old sketch… needs tweaking. 
If there is a machinist out there that wants to take a stab at this please PM me. My local guy is not a gun guy but I’d be working with him. I think you guys woud understand what I’m after without me standing there.
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Viewing 9 replies - 1 through 9 (of 9 total)
Is that Hoot’s old gun?
That shiny bit out the barrel looks familiar.
Jim
Regarding the shorter, stiffer barrel being less prone to “timing”…absolutely. The harmonics will be higher frequency and lower amplitude. This will lessen barrel whip as the pellet exits and get you better accuracy.
The larger barrel will also keep it’s temperature longer as there is more mass to heat up/cool down.
Regards,
Jim
Don’t apologize. I was feeling grumpy. I’m having flashbacks to a few years ago with my off road (jeep) clubs. Everyone was going bigger and stronger and those of us who liked tinkering with the little things or building for anything other than extreme/hardcore trails just got passed over.
This is FUN for me. If it works I’ll come back and stick my tongue out (if I can find a good smiley) if it doesn’t, I’ll come back and make fun of myself.
Don’t need more power, less would be okay. Don’t want longer, it’s currently shorter than my (old) edgun and it WILL stay that way. Trying to do something NEW with an internal bushing/baffle set that could benefit others too.
This it what I’m toying with (minus the mini mod)
Sorry Bean, got a little off track there.
Regarding the shorter, stiffer barrel being less prone to “timing”…absolutely. The harmonics will be higher frequency and lower amplitude. This will lessen barrel whip as the pellet exits and get you better accuracy.
The larger barrel will also keep it’s temperature longer as there is more mass to heat up/cool down.
Regards,
Jim
nevermind, 🙄
I agree with gimmick. CO2 needs time to change from liquid to gas and for the gas to expand and propel the pellet.
However, it is possible to lengthen barrel and achieve lower velocities as well. It all depends on the power available as the friction will quickly slow the pellet if the force behind it is insufficient.
Regards,
Jim
Okay, I hear ya, if you’re plinking then CO2 is great as you have the time for sight-in rounds. For hunters and long range shooters, 40+ yards, we need reliable high power performance.
But I suggest you keep your barrel length the same… shortening it reduces velocity… that’s the same rule for firearms, PCP, springers, and CO2.
I appreciate you thoughts on on the barrel. I agree the delivery pressure is the bigger issue. I’ll leave it that….
Had three AF rifles running on HPA and frankly, THAT wasn’t worth the hassle, TO ME. Folks have different goals from there guns. I sold one of the rifles and all 4 of my HPA tanks and have happily been shooting co2 year round since. My HPA needs are filled buy other rifles. As for # of shots…. how do you get 800 shots off an HPA tank? 😉
My co2 talon in .22 is as good as my edgun was at 30 yards for 7 out of 10 shots (accuracy not power). My .177 doesn’t fair as well at that distance but at 10 – 20y for offhand shooting it actually has more power than I need/want.
Gotta choose the right tool for the job… Paper, silhouettes, tin cans, army men, bottle caps, paintballs…. don’t need power to ‘die’. I only need enough power to get a pellet to them along a consistent/predictable trajectory.
Surely the barrel’s temperature doesn’t play a part in the accuracy… isn’t it more likely that your CO2 pressure stabilizes as the CO2 tank and valve cool down?
As the tank cools the PSI drops until you reach a stable plateau which your scope is set for.
My point? shortening the barrel reduces the velocity as the CO2 gas has less time to transfer its energy to the pellet. A Condor gets around 20fpe with its longer barrel when running CO2.
You’re better off switching to HPA. You can get many shots with a 2600psi fill (my favorite starting pressure). You save hassle, money, and get consistent shot-to-shot performance no matter how much time you leave between shots.
Viewing 9 replies - 1 through 9 (of 9 total)
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That shiny bit out the barrel looks familiar.
Jim
Naa, that’s all me. Bought that one new. And who besides me buy’s Talon frames…. 😛 The shiny thing was purchased new as an LDC for a Talon SS Frame with a 12″ barrel. I chopped it up quite a bit to work with the Talon frame and 12″ barrel. It’s no longer attached on a regular basis (motivating myself to build the internal bushing/baffle) but I do toss is back on when I go to my pop’s, saves about 50% of the noise even as short as it is.