R&L Shrouds Exploded and Examined…
http://www.rlairgunsupply.com is where the shrouds come from. I accessed two of them. He makes three models that I am aware of, the three baffle, the four baffle and the seven baffle.
I will examine the four and seven baffle models.
For the sake of understanding, my opinion will be the moderators used on the Talon Stubby “Extreme” in .25 caliber. I will post some pics and comments on the Hi Flo and Extreme valves in “Mods and Machinists” for those interested. (They look identical)
First lets take a look at the four baffle moderator:
All steel construction. The knurled cap screws on securely. Note the “cup” plastic baffles very similar to those used in the Marauder system. The end of the moderator is threaded and screws onto an adapter that replaces the forward barrel brace. The moderator weighs 9.325 oz.
The OAL is 6.75 inches:
The outside tube diameter is 1.017 inches:
All the R & L baffles appear to be identical.
The length is 1.29 inches:
Inside diameter is 0.74 inches:
The hole at the baffled end measures .270″ in diameter.
The 12″ moderator is going to bring the OAL of the Talon Stubby to 37″, but reduces the discharge sound to hammer slap and pellet impact.
It measures 11.75″ and has seven baffles. Otherwise, it is identical to the four baffle model, but weighs 11.35 ounces.
Holding the moderator onto the Talon Stubby is a steel adapter that replaces the forward most barrel brace. It’s milled from a single piece of steel, and is roughly 1.25″ in length. As with the OEM barrel brace, the adapter has one threaded grub screw hole, with two larger unthreaded holes next to it.
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The threads are finely milled and the fit is excellent.
The adapter fits very snugly onto the Talon barrel. I needed to sand my barrel a thousandth or so to get mine to tightly slide on.
The new Talon barrels are attached with four (4) grub screws, two on the bottom and two on the left side of the barrel. Once the adapter is fitted and grubbed in, the other holes line up perfectly.
The way the adapter is constructed, only the moderator is utilized to minimize muzzle blast. It would be possible to vent back into the shroud but would best be done by a machinist to drill the vent holes. This is not something to be done with anything less than a good drill press and a rock solid fixture to hold the adapter firmly in place during drilling.
I believe the effectiveness of the moderator would be considerably enhanced with drilling both barrel mounts and utilizing all of the shroud for pressure relief. A few vent holes would further enhance the effectiveness of the unit.
Conclusions:
1) This is an all steel, carefully milled instrument, black anodized, and is very heavy duty in its construction, and accordingly more heavy than an aluminum tubed model. The cost seems quite low for this quality.
2) The three and four baffle models will reduce your sound signature substantially in calibers .22 and .25, but your neighbors will hear you shooting if they are very near your property. I liken the sound to a good shroud PCP with end cap and no baffles.
In my opinion, this would be good for hunting, but should not be used in close proximity to touchy neighbors. That being said, a reduction in power setting, and caliber, plus using a standard Talon valve, or the Condor valve, would both have an impact on the sound signature. It will not be silent, but quiet enough for most individual’s general use. And, it is very short, and looks good on the Stubby.
The 12″, which is identical in cost, is vastly more effective with seven baffles. Hammer slap and pellet impact quiet in caliber .22 and .25, and used with the “Extreme” valve, depending on power settings.
It adds weight and length to the Stubby. However, if you need quiet, real quiet, this is the way to go in the R & L lineup. If you order no moderator, $110.00 per ea., you will get a standard Talon end cap, and can then choose whatever direction you want in weight, length, width, and effectiveness on any modifier that fits the Talon frame.
Regards,
Kindly ‘Ol Uncle Hoot 😯
“Battling stupidity and ignorance since 1965!“
All Replies
For .277″ to work every thing has to fit perfect. My bushings fit the barrel perfect and fit the frame perfect. In the shroud I have a bushing that aligns the end of the barrel perfectly in the center of the shroud. It is made of delrin and fits the barrel snug and also has a o ring in it to make it even a tighter fit. .002″ out of alignment adds up to a lot more at the end of the shroud.
My .257 has a smaller first baffle hole at .275″ and the shroud is 22″ long.
It’s not a .22 it’s a .25 and the longer barrels have an alignment device on the end of the barrel, which isn’t on the 6″ shroud. The shroud on the TalonP is only held on the bushing end. However, I’m not sure what the alignment issue could be. The barrel is tight to frame and when I look in breech end, I see the bore ligned up concentric, with the endcap.
I contacted the mfg. and he said the hole should be just under. .300 and is sending a new endcap. He said some were mfg’d, too small. We will see if this fixes the problem.
Because I can visually see the bore and endcap are concentric, to the eye, and because the barrel and shroud are tight, I’m operating under the belief that the endcap should be a bit larger, or there is some delflection in the pellet by some other unknown force to cause it to strike the endcap. Nothing else makes sense. In a perfect world, .277 should be enough clearance. But maybe it’s just a stability issue that is the result of air pressure and pellet weight. I’m going to have to experiement with other weights and power setting, I guess.
.277″ for .22 is more than enough. You have alignment problems. Could be your bushings being to loose and making the barrel not sit in the center of the frame.
My .257 has a smaller first baffle hole at .275″ and the shroud is 22″ long.
I know. Old post
Anyone know what the hole diameter of the end cap should be for the 6″ R.L. shroud, for the TalonP? I have a perfectly sighted in TalonP (without shroud), but when I put the shroud on, and verify it’s perfectly concentric, pellets will graze the hole edges.
Mine measures .277. Some have suggested boring out to .3 but I’m interested in what it’s supposed to be and what others have in theirs. AND do any of you have the problem of pellet striking endcap?
There are several forum members skilled in the making of such items, Tony TT Tunes being the “Cadillac”, and several others who make remarkably efficient shrouds.
R & L is one example of a heavy duty shroud which is effective, and very well built. However, there are other forum members who desire a much lighter aluminum model, and that’s where some of our members really shine.
To each his own tastes….
Hoot 😀
I can attest to the effectiveness of the R & L shroud! I took it off the 24″ barrel just to see the difference. Without the shroud my Talon sounds like a 22 rimfire. I live in a rural area but still have neighbors close by so I only left it off for about a half dozen shots.
I received my R&L shroud for a Talon SS w/ a 24″ barrel and must say it looks good. The bluing is dark and the all of the threads fit nicely with their mating parts. I plan to order the R&L shroud bushing so I can also use it on my 12 inch barrel. I will have to get some 3/4″ delrin rod to make some baffles to fill the void since the longer barrel extends about 4-1/2″ into the shroud. Thanks Hoot for the review because I wouldn’t have bought one otherwise.
I posted in the Shrouds forum how I managed to vent my R & L shroud into the frame with a couple simple tools. It will take from one to two hours, depending on how determined you are. It’s extremely simple.
Worked out fine and it is allowing plenty of air to expand and vent quietly out the bottom of the Talon frame.
Check it out, I posted it late last night.
Regards,
Kindly ‘Ol Uncle Hoot 😯
I just got 2 from Randy for my Condor for an 18” and 24” barrel. You will need the compression fitting for your Talon and the 24” barrel.The bushing model is esier to install. There is no o ring on the compression fitting. Randy said the pic is an older one. I just leave the compression fitting on the 24” barrel when I change to a shorter barrel, 18”. As someone said more baffles is more quiet.
Benson.
I got the same shroud for the same purpose a couple weeks ago, I am very satisfied with the installation and the performance.
So the adpater is not drilled to allow air expansion back into the frame.
That’s seems contrary to what all say about gaining quiet ?
i just got my answer, it will be the compression fitting because I have a 24 inch barrel. I think I will order the replacement barrel bushing so I can use the shroud with my 12 inch barrels too.
After reading this thread I ordered a shroud from R&L today for a unit that will fit a Talon SS with a 24 inch barrel. Shortly after I placed my order I received an email with instructions for the shroud. In the instructions there is a compression fitting, not the steel adapter that replaces a barrel bushing as is shown here. I really like the idea of the steel adapter that replaces a barrel bushing rather than a compression fitting. Does anyone know which one I should expect?
I emailed Randy asking this question too but was hoping someone here could tell me.
Anyone here make custom baffels for this R&L shroud? I have the 4 baffel model now with compression fitting for 24 inch barrel. How much difference do you think they will make having different shapped baffels or more thinner ones? I just ordered a the newer shroud that screws on to the barrel bushings. He said it would take a couple weeks.
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First, I started a new thread on this, in the other forum.
But I also measured the inner diameter of the shourd bushing, as well as the outside diameter of the barrle. There is a .008″ difference. Since the screw is, per the instructions, not supposed to be tight, this much of a gap could cause a misalignment. The original bushing was only .002 larger and fit very snug.
The video is in the other thread.