Thinking of drilling and doweling the breech to the upper
I have done a good bit of wrenching on my guns already and one area of design that bothers me is as follows. I have continually noticed that the breeches and the uppers have room to be manipulated as to their exact alignment and are only limited to the I.D. clearance in the upper and the O.D. diameter of the barrel. None have been perfectly aligned when initially disassembled but I do put them back as close to aligned as possible when I put them together. This alignment is just two flat faces kept in alignment by compressive forces when the moderator is tightened on the barrel. As an example my R3M/R3 .25 have .020″ clearance between the two components. Math would have me believe that .003″ of slippage or movement back there could be compounded to effect POI by almost .500″ at 50 yards with 3 times that much available in extreme shift.
#1: What do the people here think about this modification, It is very reversible with just removing the dowels. ??
#2: Would it be better to make matching counter bores in both components and make a disc that fits and fills both voids for the locator. ??
Doug…
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Nice work….. U r brave!!!
well I did it she aint a virgin anymore as a matter of fact there are more mods to come,no movement there thanks to a CNC machine, heeeee haaaa
Check the spacer Dr. Evil Knievel has machined to remedy his problem with chancing POI. It´s on his DIY-thread somewhere .. :geekn:
Chaps,
Before I forget, I counterbored the adapter on the ‘shroud end’ to minimise the distance the pellet had to travel through a 7mm hole (obviously adjust this size according to cal, 8mm – 8.5mm may be better for a .25)
The counterbore is approx 8mm deep and…
…wide
I also turned down this bit….
…just to make it look a bit erm, prettier ?!?!
Obviously flavour to your taste, but this works for me.
Cheers Chaps,
The Cad
Hi Donny,
I had this done by a local engineering firm as a one-off to see if it’d work before posting it on here.
My eyes are still watering at the price they charged me for it 😯
I did enquire about getting a few done but the price was still ooh-owww !
I’m sure there would be people more local to yourself that would be more realistic with there charges, plus there could be complications with sending items like this Stateside through Customs.
I’m sure NC or Ernest could cast an eye over the plan and give you guys a more reasonable price than what I would get – any improvements, modifications or suggestions to the original would be gratefully recieved. I’ve learnt so much from this forum that I thought it was high time to give something back 😀
Cheers Chaps,
The Cad
JohnP, how about a group buy??? 🙂
a few photos with the ‘ol phone –
The new shroud with adapter
1/2″ UNF adapter without thread protector
..and with mod attached
Works a treat with the extra holes in the shroud, I’m looking at making up my own mod but the ‘off the shelf’ one works fine – loudest thing is the pellet ‘thwack’ on it’s intended target !
Enjoy….
The Cad
Chaps,
a few photos with the ‘ol phone –
The new shroud with adapter
1/2″ UNF adapter without thread protector
..and with mod attached
Works a treat with the extra holes in the shroud, I’m looking at making up my own mod but the ‘off the shelf’ one works fine – loudest thing is the pellet ‘thwack’ on it’s intended target !
Enjoy….
The Cad
Here we go chaps,
I had one of these made up to replace the OEM shroud in Aluminium with the adaptor in Brass.
Works a treat and keeps the barrel tensioning intact, plus now I can use any ‘off the shelf’ 1/2″ UNF mod
Cheers,
The Cad
I would not choose a shroud fastened with only grub screw for the reason you mentioned. It will move. If the frame moves with the barrel, then there might not be dramatic changes in poi. With my gun I experienced shift because the barrel is smaller in od than the holes in the frame. Hence the need for shims. Also, my shroud screws on like the oem unit. However, I can only hand tighten it will never be as tight as the oem unit. My shroud is tight, but not enough to benefit from the “stretching effect”.
Ideally, I would like to keep the oem shroud if I could attach an LDC to make it as quiet as I need it be. For now, my current set up does the job.
Gabe
Yes. I need to email NC and ask him if he can make a Moderator that will go into place of OEM shroud Cover.
I have talk to NC years ago about this issue. He doesn’t have the tools or tube size, so I ended on bonding a FX 6″ shroud extension then screw on a Ldc adapter. Call him he may have the tools and tube now.
Unscrew OEM shroud cover (they are all the same for .22 or .25 R3) . It will expose the baffles. Then screw in replacement cover that is integrated to additional 5-7 inches of bigger in diameter moderator.
With This design there is no need to mess with Barrel mounting. It will retain OEM baffles, retain OEM barrel nut/stretching.
Here is a quick hand drawing LOL
Does it makes sense?
I have talk to NC years ago about this issue. He doesn’t have the tools or tube size, so I ended on bonding a FX 6″ shroud extension then screw on a Ldc adapter. Call him he may have the tools and tube now.
I would not choose a shroud fastened with only grub screw for the reason you mentioned. It will move. If the frame moves with the barrel, then there might not be dramatic changes in poi. With my gun I experienced shift because the barrel is smaller in od than the holes in the frame. Hence the need for shims. Also, my shroud screws on like the oem unit. However, I can only hand tighten it will never be as tight as the oem unit. My shroud is tight, but not enough to benefit from the “stretching effect”.
Ideally, I would like to keep the oem shroud if I could attach an LDC to make it as quiet as I need it be. For now, my current set up does the job.
Gabe
Yes. I need to email NC and ask him if he can make a Moderator that will go into place of OEM shroud Cover.
I have talk to NC years ago about this issue. He doesn’t have the tools or tube size, so I ended on bonding a FX 6″ shroud extension then screw on a Ldc adapter. Call him he may have the tools and tube now.
Unscrew OEM shroud cover (they are all the same for .22 or .25 R3) . It will expose the baffles. Then screw in replacement cover that is integrated to additional 5-7 inches of bigger in diameter moderator.
With This design there is no need to mess with Barrel mounting. It will retain OEM baffles, retain OEM barrel nut/stretching.
Here is a quick hand drawing LOL
Does it makes sense?
#1: What do the people here think about this modification, It is very reversible with just removing the dowels. ??
#2: Would it be better to make matching counter bores in both components and make a disc that fits and fills both voids for the locator. ??
Doug…
I would go with option #2. Did a similar operation to my R3 in the front end of the barrel/scope support.
http://www.talonairgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=284720#p284720
Dr.:evil:
Ridetoeat
I too am changing out an r3m breech to a r3 breech. Parts should be here next week. Any chance you could take some pics of the process? Especially the barrel removal?
I agree with you. That will keep the tension to hold the barrel firmly.
If he can make two piece moderators with regular 1/2-20 adapter are even better. that allows people using their silencer. Just like yours, but break in two.
Neil emailed me and told me that he will need to have the rifle there in order for him to see if he can do it.
He is also unsure if he has the proper tools or will be able to cut the threads to match factory threads for the Shroud Cover.
I might have to email ED and see if he can help with dimensions and thread sizes.
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Good work Fan !!! Now I have to catch up to you on this one… I haven’t got my parts out to the the shop yet.