Condor W/ R&L Valve Convert To .257?
I have a Condor with a R&L valve and just a standard hammer and .25 AF LW barrel. I am looking to convert it to a cast bullet shooter besides the Surefires which are pretty limited range and accuracy if it is possible and viable (I don’t have a ton of spare time). I am reading here that Doug/Dyotat100 makes custom parts and guns towards this end. Doug do you have a web site or sell to the general public or is this all very limited custom work? It sounds as if the R&L valve gets things only part way there since it is a ported hi-flo valve and there are better valves available out there? Then there are the right .257 barrels to secure? Hammers? Etc..? It sounds like the R&L barrels need custom leads reamed in them for the specific molds which I would just as soon not attempt? Anyone reputable selling completed custom guns anymore or the parts at this point to fix up a Condor? Is this a lost cause at this point? Any guidance is appreciated. Thanks
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You won’t get 200 fpe in 24″ barrel. Maybe if you use 4000 + psi but I dint see it. It will be a 2 shot gun and a clean up.
I got 170 fpe with 24″ barrel and 89.5 gr slugs in .25. That was my .25 valve that I built and massaged a lot.
But to get any kind of shot count you have turn it down.
I get 215 fpe with 93 gr with 32″ barrel
200 FPE and maybe 5 shots in a compact size is basically a home defense weapon.
Knife,
Can it be made into a BP gun though….lol! That’s what would get everyones panties all wet…….lol!
BP a condor and the world will cream. š š
The Condor Platform may very well end up being Respected in the AG World in spite of it’s self and it’s short comings. Finally! I know of no other current platform that can do what it can be configured to do. :8:
It’s almost as iff we are going to be able to say to the AG World, “WE TOLD YA SO!” š š
Knife
It will have low shot count. The good thing about the condor is being able to use
53 and 62 ci tanks.
Tube guns just aren’t the same. I have a .308 Haley and will be selling it because it just doesn’t compare to my .308 condor. Yes with 4000+ psi fills it makes more power. But psi for psi the condor makes more.
The other thing I have found out is the Haley has POI change when going from 118 gr to 158 gr. Condor doesn’t change or if it does it isn’t enough to make it so I can’t hit a coke can at 110 yds. The Haley drops 8-12″.
I think the Edgun guys are already realizing some of the limitations of the design for trying to use cast slugs. Wingman from NZ is seeing a wall with the current hammer/valve for increasing the power level significantly w/o some major redesign of the platform. I was afraid of that. The AF platform seems to lend itself to significant hammer/valve changes.
“oldgoat wrote:
WOW Wingman, If you can come up with a modified valve and reg that shoots a 30 cal 85 grain HP at 800 fps, I am very interested!
Please keep us informed and I would very much like to buy a modified valve and reg from you!
Nice looking cast bullets!
I was a mouse click away from ordering a .30cal Matador Std but decided against it for one reason, I already have .25cal PCPs and I couldn’t see me using a 47gr pellet spitting .30cal for anything that I couldn’t use my .25 cal slinging a 36gr pellet for.. So I got thinking.. I want a .30cal but I want it to have at least enough energy to take deer or pigs..
The building of a reg and valve is not really the challenge, I have my doubts whether the Matador Hammer design will have the mass and inertia to free the amount of regulated air required to push a .30cal 85gr slug that fast even with spring mods etc.
I have three options here;
* Make a heavier hammer and an extension for a longer heavier hammer spring that extends forward of the spring tensioner..
* Base the build on a different PCP with a more tunable “in line hammer” design. š (I was hoping to used the Matador for its larger air cylinder specs to achieve approx 10-12 shots)
* Build one from scratch.. I have the means and capabilities but the only suitable material for an air cylinder available to me is 1 1/4″ OD so shot count will suffer. I have a friend who makes big bores here and to him 85gr @ 800fps (120)ftlbs is child’s play.. he builds pistols that can achieve that.. I have showed him my plans and he thinks 100gr cast bullets at 950fps (200ftlbs) is easily achievable.. he has scratch built many big bore PCPs so I will take his word for it..
Ill ponder it over the next few weeks of my holiday and eventually make a decision..”
I love all this 257 talk. GREAT FOR YOU GUYS
No parts yet. Just learning and saving. š It’s currently setup with the R&L Extreme valve and standard AF .25 barrel but I have it tuned down to 1000 FPS with Kings. I still plan on going the .257 cast route.
Hey secoda still going the condor .257 route? have you got any parts yet? i picked me up a condor .25 and installed the wakguard ā¦.. gotta save for my new .30 gun that will be ready soon. but i would like to start collecting the parts for a .257. I’m gonna shoot it like it is for a little while. just waiting on the TT shroud. should have it for xmas š š
I am going to read all of the casting postings here and elsewhere to get up to speed. I don’t live that far from Missouri bullet where I have always purchased most of my cast slugs but I have never studied them much. Normally, someone was always telling me which pistol bullets to secure. š
After owning two Matadors and a Cricket, I may be just a wee bit less optimistic on getting much more power out of the existing hardware w/o a design change. Ed has the current regulators near maxed out for the 30 cal pellets and even my Standard 30 cal has slightly reduced power (about 30-35 FPS slower and only 75 FPE) from the long because of the shorter barrel length. Even the valves at this level seem to get stressed over time. A new valve/regulator design might be a game changer, though, and that is exactly what I think Ed is currently working on for a 357. KalibrGun has been testing a 357 Cricket as well but initially I heard they weren’t happy with the power level among other issues and KalibrGun has a lot of R&D money relatively speaking. Most of the .357s out are more short range lower velocity high energy hunters. Nothing like you guys are getting from the custom tank/valve AF based guns. I agree, though, it would be cool and I have been wrong before.
SEC, RC and Cedric gave me kinda a crash course. That, and I did a LOT of research. And have been chasing the learning curve ever since. (All of a couple of months. LOL!!!)
In a short time, I gave gone thru a dip pot (Elect. Lyman), and propane set up. (Way too hot when summer hits here in Texas!), and now a bottom pour cheapie pot from Lee. It is the new improved valve version. I Love it!!! š
Last night, I was bored and decided to do a little casting. I cast for about 2 hours, (Iām ultra slow and still learning the cadence) and still managed to cast over 650 Noe flat point 60 grain, 20-1 lead tin bullets. WooHoo, That is over 5.2 pounds of bullets! š
Biggest problem I have run into, is it is addicting as hell! And it really feels good to shoot the bullets you create yourself. š
And cost wise, it beats the PA buy three, and get one free deal all to hell. š
And when those .257 hit, Man, it is unbelievable compared to my .25 with Kings.
Accuracy is unreal. Even out of the lowly AF platform.
I would love a cricket or ed gun, but not if I had to step down on power, and step backwards from the accuracy I am getting at 100+ yards. An from a Talon SS frame no less. Can’t help but wonder what an ed or cricket could do with these bullets if set up for them.
Can’t wait to see what Old Goat comes up with! If he is successful, it is going to be a game changer for sure. š š
Knife
Looks like a complete build is necessary. I see where folks tried to piece meal a valve or hammer just to be disappointed and they have to go back to the well. I want to do it right the first time. Now I need to learn a bit about the casting side. I have shot thousands of commercial cast slugs in PBs but never made them.
Oh Hell Yeah!! Can’t Wait! š š
That is with 53 ci tank. You have to give up some fps to get more shots.
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Can it be made into a BP gun though….lol! That’s what would get everyones panties all wet…….lol!
BP a condor and the world will cream. š š
don’t see why not Tof! A new stock and plumb a bottle under the barrel for the forearm!
with te dovetail rail under the frame, it would be an easy conversion!
Doug, You listening??? š
Our Doug for the conversion, and the Stock making Doug for the Stock. We could call it the DD Talon/Dor BP!!! :8:
Knife