I cant get to zero
I need you guy advice, pls help me with my r3m 22 cal matador. I cant get it to zero it keep shooting high to a point that my elevation is max out to UP position and still shooting high. I have a hawk sidewinder tactical 8.5x25x42 with medium high scope ring.. What should i do. Hoot reconmeded put shim at the rear scope ring that didnt work…
Thank you guys..
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Thank you guys for your help. My problem is solve, hoot was right to put shim between the ring and the scope. But not the rear, it should be infront of the scope ring. I used 3 strip of electric tape in front of the scope ring to raise the front end a bit higher. After that i was shooting clover shape hole at 60 yards.. So if anyone else having the same problem just put 3 strip of electric tape between the scope ring and the scope……make sure in FRONT of scope ring…..
I have done this several times. It works.
If you want to change the slope of your scope rail a few degrees.
1) remove the scope rings and rail.
2) wrap the muzzle end of the rail in heavy cloth or cardboard.
3) put he wrapped end of the rail in a vise and apply some hand pressure to gently bend the rail muzzle end up
4) frequently take the rail out of the vise and lay it upside down on a flat surface to observe if any and how much you have bent the rail. Take your time and don’t over do it.
5) stop bending when the rail has about 1/16 (or less) rise (arch) in it (for scopes that run out of adjustment – poi is high and can’t be lowered any further)
6) remount the scope with the muzzle end ring as close to the end of the rail as possible.
The slight bend is not noticeable.
All good advice so far, but you need to start with the basics and work your way out from there.
Try a different scope if you can or try the scope on a different rifle. If the problem follows the scope is to blame.
Try a different set of scope rings or move the rear ring to the front and the front to the rear. If it now shoots low, that’s your problem.
Shine a light in the breach and look down the barrel. If the barrel has an upward bend, that’ could be your problem.
Put a straight edge down your Picatinny rail. Check if it’s bent.
Start with anyone of these, until all four have been eliminated. It should be one of these, if not, you may have a real problem.
It just doesn’t make sense to me that he is getting a baffle strike. If he is shooting a perfectly high group then I would rule out a strike. Every time I have had a strike my patterns were all over the place. Clipping in my experience does not cause a perfect POI shift. The other factor is a bad scope. Maybe he should try a different scope.
I had a Theoben that Allen Z checked out for me. It did the same as this EDgun. In the end we used the FX no limit rings and I zeroed the scope that way. So this has happened to me before.
It’s okay in my option to shim for barrel drooping.
But he is max out in his turret adjustments down and it’s still hitting high at 25 yards.
Even at 25 yards he should have enough scope elevation adjustments to zero even with the 1/2 a degree tilt rail ED employed.
On the 6.5-20×40 scope, for example, there is 45 MOA of up adjustment and 35 MOA of down from optical center.
On the 25x is should be about that also.
That is not normal of a condition to have to shim a optical center scopes front ring 1/8 ” or so thick to obtain zero at 25 yards ?
~ GKU
Dear NoMo….
The best “zero distance” for any caliber is the average distance at which you shoot the most! The gun is indifferent to this factor, because it will out shoot you, no matter what distance you “zero” it in.
If you target shoot at 50 or 100 yards, then zero at one of those distances. If you hunt, determine the most common range your game will be from your muzzle, then you can use the mil-dots to shoot slightly above or below to accommodate for any difference. I zero mine it at 30 meters.
I don’t believe there is such a thing as a specific distance which is best for accuracy for any gun or caliber. The Edgun drooped rail only allows the scope to be adjusted for longer shots for air guns, IF you need to shoot that far.
Thank you Hoot. I had figured a 30 / 35 yd zero for my shooting. You confirmed that.
Hoot:
Dear NoMo….
The best “zero distance” for any caliber is the average distance at which you shoot the most! The gun is indifferent to this factor, because it will out shoot you, no matter what distance you “zero” it in.
If you target shoot at 50 or 100 yards, then zero at one of those distances. If you hunt, determine the most common range your game will be from your muzzle, then you can use the mil-dots to shoot slightly above or below to accommodate for any difference. I zero mine it at 30 meters.
I don’t believe there is such a thing as a specific distance which is best for accuracy for any gun or caliber. The Edgun drooped rail only allows the scope to be adjusted for longer shots for air guns, IF you need to shoot that far.
Hoot:
Even if it is a long range rifle, it shouldn’t have issues zeroing at 25 yds. I do it all the time because my shooting arrangement is less than 50yds. Do what Gku suggested, take off after market baffle cover, check for clipping on the baffles then put on the OEM baffle cover. See how your groups are.
I have had this happen to lots of guns. I am a long range shooter and the MOA relationship between the bore axis and line of sight is often overlooked by shooters. The first thing you need to do is rule out mechanical problems with the gun. If your EDgun is shooting the same hole at 25 yards then it is not clipping the baffles. Keep in mind that EDguns are long range airguns. I typically zero my guns between 75 and 100 yards. Ed had built in more MOA on his rail as well. I wouldn’t even think about a sub 50 yard zero on a Matador. Back to the problem. Once you have established the gun is mechanically sound, there is no clipping you are going to have to adjust the line of sight and bore axis. In other words you need to decrease the MOA. Another common misconception is the ring hight plays a role in zero, not really high vs medium rings really do not change the line of sight to the bore that much. Think of it this way. The pellet never rises, as soon as it comes out of the barrel the earth begins to want the pellet so it falls. The zero is only the point where your line of sight matches the falling pellet. The parabola seen on a ballistic chart is really only the relationship between line of sight and the earth’s gravity.
So if there is nothing wrong with your gun you need to remove MOA, you do that by raising the FRONT of the scope. This will pull the line of sight down and decrease MOA. I feel the best way to accomplish this is with adjustable scope rings, but you can cut soda cans or use film on the front ring. I do not like shimming but it will work.
The other option is to zero the rifle at 50 or 75 yards and then use hold under for close shots. I for one would be super excited to have a ton of turns on my turret while having a 50-75 yard zero. That would be a sweet long range gun. I actually bought a 20 MOA scope base for my new Vulcan just to get more spins on the turret.
2. Never took the gun apart
3. I have one of those threaded buffle cover i got from one of the member here
Like Donny said, I wouldn’t rule out clipping yet.
What is this threaded buffle cover, it could be the one that’s causing the problem also ?
Try reinstall the factory one back.
I know you said it’s shooting high but disregard it for now and for this test.
Test shoot and check the accuracy and the size of the groups, it should be very small (one hole group).
If it resembles a small or large shotgun blast pattern at 25 yards it must be clipping.
If the grouping is a one hole size but POI is high.
Look and see if the gap between the barrel/shroud and air cylinder it perfectly parallel.
If not read Marco’s post http://talonairgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=31748#p321221
~ GKU
So, with they way they have the rail set, what is the recommended zero distance in .22 ?
Probably, same issue.
http://talonairgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=31748
I know that the weaver rail is designed to have 0.5deg tilt, according to Ed’s information, which should give zero at 100m.
But in fact, some guns shoot much higher than that, and possibly barrel is aimed higher than it is designed during assembly.
Marco.
All R3’s and R3ms scope rails are not leveled , inorder to reach longer range, the front is lower than the rear. If you dont prefer shimming the front front mount, i suggest you bring both mounts closer to the rear end of the rail.
Best regards
Adham
1. Around. 25 yards
2. Never took the gun apart
3. I have one of those threaded buffle cover i got from one of the member here
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WELL….for your information, in Arkansas…the front of the scope IS the rear of the scope everywhere else!!! We mount our scopes backwards. Since everything looks so far away to us in the scope, we just add “00” to the distance we shoot at. So, if you have limited space in which to shoot, put your scope on backwards and shoot at 1 yard from the muzzle. It’s exactly the same image you would get by looking through the other end at 100 yards!
Therefore, technically my advice was correct…just not outside of Arkansas!
Kind regards,
Uncle Hoot: