Anyone here like the AK-47 or AK-74?
The AK-47 is actually illegal here in CT, but I wanted to hear your thoughts on these types of rifles.
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If a Galil is a second rate clone, then the Valmet must be awesome rifle. I have heard of them, but never have I had the chance to inspect or shoot one. Someday. Thanks for the lesson.
just remember the Gali is a second rate clone of the European Valmetand designed for far different environments
Well said, Heckler!
I had forgotten about the Galil. It is a beautiful, functional work of art. It is on my wish list. 😉
When you absotively posilutely have to kill everyone on the bus accept no substitute. Especially with armor piercing ammo.
Mine works fine even if I’m mudsucked but there’s much better more expensive assault rifles that I’ve used or had that are far more accurate.
Millions of bodies over the last 60 years is testament to the sound design of the Kalashnikov.
First I must preface this by stating I am in no way to be considered a fan of the AK/AKM series platform in its normal renditions
that said the idea that the AK series is inaccurate is based primarily upon the common variants and the use of crappy mil spec ammo from third world military production…
when I state “common” I refer to the Chinese mfg’d models and most particularly the ABSOLUTE TRASH by the Romainians, worse yet, the rifles built on burn’t out torched parts sets with crappy out of spec US recievers and sub standard Green Mountain barrels for outfits like Century Arms.
if thats your main basis for accuracy statements you are way out of your depth
If you want to see what this platform can do when built right get a Valmet 62S and accept no substitute. Owned my first 62Sin the 70s…only ammo available then was Lalupa match grade. Rifle would easily take K zone out to 300 yards and do so in -20 degree temps. The Valmets were never cheap and the 62S was the flagship of the Finnish imports. Owned at least a dozen Valmets over the years since and all were strikingly accurate, extremely high quality AK series rifles.
Another never to be sneezed at is the IMI Galil AR & ARM…basically a Valmet 62S receiver with a FAL side folder…and it must be an IMI rifle, not one of the trashy Century Arms clones built of burnt out parts sets from Central America.
Lastly any of the Mitchell Arms imported Zastava AKs manufactured in the former Yugoslavia…again not the Century knock offs, the real deal imported in the 80s. These are not quite as precision as the Valmets or Galils but are still far better than current shit by a long shot.
Same goes for Dragonovs
no the Romainian PSL does NOT count…more garbage
Had a Chinese NDM86 Dragonov rig a number of years back. With the right ammo and an actual Soviet PS01 I was regularly drilling coffee cans at 500 yards on the Dakota praries
Have a buddy in Canada with a real deal Soviet Draganov in the transit chest dated in the early 70s. With his handloads it is nearly as accuarte as the best of the NM M1As I have owned or shot and a damn bit better than some.
quite a bit of hogwash on the accuracy of the AK out there
depends on who made the rifle and what you are feeding it more than any other set of factors
PS…I never had one reliability issue Ever in the dead of winter with my Valmet 62s which is a great deal more than I can say for ARs, M1As, FALs, HKs, AUGs
or for that matter most any bolt action rifle
the Finnish military designed the 62 for regular use in sub zero field work and its about the most superb rifle for that environmental set ever produced turn key from the box anywhere ever in the history of firearms.
here is a 1980 Interarm advertisment for their line of Valmet AKs which were the first AK series rifles made available to the US consumer:
The AK fills a specific niche. Survival during bad times. Lightweight, .30 caliber (124 grain @ 2300 fps). Large capacity magazines/drums=firepower! Proven relaible under the worst conditions. It is also a fraction of the cost of an M-1A. You need to try both….then buy both. 😀
If I am in a situation where I am going to need more than 30 rounds without time for a reload, I am not sticking around. 😛
Plus big drum magazines suck. They may be reliable, but they are big and round. Super heavy, and they make the gun hard to hold well. As inaccurate as the ak is, a drum just makes it harder to hold. 😛 Even if a gun of mine had the capability of using big drums, I wouldn’t get one. 20-30 rounds is plenty.
The reliability of them is hard to beat though. 🙂
AA12 shot gun.
Anyone see it in “action” in the movie The Expendables?
That would be my choice for a home defense weapon. 😆
There is not a 75 or 100 round drum for the M-1A. I think the largest capacity magazine is 30 rounds. I don’t want to talk you out of an M-1A.
The AK fills a specific niche. Survival during bad times. Lightweight, .30 caliber (124 grain @ 2300 fps). Large capacity magazines/drums=firepower! Proven relaible under the worst conditions. It is also a fraction of the cost of an M-1A. You need to try both….then buy both. 😀
M1A would be a good one.
I don’t have much of a problem with recoil. I shoot the mosin a lot without a problem. Learning to control it with the blaser now, and I can keep it on the target during the shot. Granted it has a big brake on it, but it still has recoil. Only problem with recoil for me is it slowing down a follow up shot. But like I said, I just don’t see the recoil being that bad.
I don’t think I could handle an ak-47, I think I would have a stroke from the inaccuracy. 😆
CETME chews up the brass with their fluted chambers. The fluting is to help release the case from the chamber for extraction. Mine leaves my shoulder black and blue from the recoil. The M-1A, now there is a rifle. The Squad Scout is a great rifle! They are accurate also. The fal is a great rifle but is heavl also.
The AK is a light and combat effective weapon. There is an episode of “Tales of the Gun” that showcases both Klasnikoff and Stoner. It is a great education about both the AR/M-16 and the AK series. I consideer it a must watch.
Haha, zombie gun. Yep. 🙂
After seeing the news about katrina, I really started wanting something like that. People going down the streets looting and raping. Total anarchy. I would really want to have something to protect myself in a situation like that. Because lets face it, there are some bad people in the world, and when the law goes away, they really start to come out.
Unfortunately I keep buying long range stuff and never stop to get something like that. 😆
I thought about a .223 ar-15, but I really don’t like the caliber. As steve said, it won’t penetrate barriers reliably, and just doesn’t have a lot of power. It’s a fun caliber, very easy to shoot, and quite accurate, but just doesn’t have the energy. I would shoot milk jugs full of water at 500 yards with mine, and they would just hop a big, and leak out. It was only hitting with 500fpe at that range. When the little bullet is relying on velocity to do it’s killing thing, and it doesn’t have any left, it is useless.
For a personal defense weapon, I really want a semi-auto .308. Not an ar, I don’t like those. I would like a FAL or something of that sort. Maybe a cetme/g3.
For now, I have my mosin nagant for defense. And if stuff gets really bad, I have a ghillie suit and the blaser. 🙂
Yes Tron! Exactly, zombie apocalypse, riot, anarchy, civil disobedience, hurricane Katrina aftermath defensive weapon.
What’s interesting is the the 7.62X39 FMJ was used by the North Hollywood Bank robbers and they shot several people who didn’t die. It’s not that leathal of a round. I am not saying that it isn’t a good round…it is. The concept came from the germans during WWII. They murdered the russians at a battle. When the russians investigated the battle field, they found many small casings. That’s when they developed the 7.62 short round and chambered it in Simonoff’s SKS. It’s a great intermediate round.
The FMJ will shoot completely through a house and still retain enough energy to hurt someone.
The 74 is a .223 caliber version. Why would you want a varmint cartridge that you know will not reliably penetrate barriers? It is a marginal performer at best. It’s great for people wearing bathing suits on the beach. .30 caliber bullets are where it’s at for a defensive rifle/carbine. I’m sure that the AK 74 would be more reliable than an AR. The AR have some issues, like if a primer get blown out of the case, it will jam the weapon and make it a paper weight. They also require cleaning.
It would be nice if you could get an opportunity to try an AK.
Not that it would be a sound $ investment, I’m sure, but is it possible to “accurize” an AK? I mean, if it can hit a man at 100 yards reliably then I can’t see what else anyone would need it to do.
I think that an AK would be a great Zombie Apocalypse gun though….
Teflon,
I’ve trained with and am very familiar with them but still wouldnt pick a carbine/rifle as my first choice for home defence (unless I lived in the country).
Rather have a shotgun, wont kill the people a few blocks away.
I agree – the idea of using an AK-47 or AR15 for home defense is strange to me, but I see a HUGE amount of posts on forums with people saying that they do just that.
The story of my posting this thread goes like this – I started playing an old computer game that had AK-47s in and they were great in the game (overpowered) so for shits and giggles I looked at how much they cost to but with no intention of doing so. Whilst doing that I saw that they are illegal in CT so thought that I’d post about them here.
Good to see you again, btw.
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The thing isnt that the IMI AR, ARM and SAR are junky, its just that the workmanship and finish is second rate to that of Valmet, particularly the comercial 62S. Understand that the best of the Valmet lot is the 62 as it used a machined forging for the reciever. The later Valmets were stampings.
The initial preproduction Galils were all constructed using modified Valmet 62 actions, Colt M16A2 1×7 twist barrels and FAL para stocks. Once the design was debugged IMI took it into production using reverse engineered and modified Valmet parts.
For example a Galil folder is a drop fit on a Valmet 62 as are a few other bits not modified for 5.56mm use.
The Valmet barrels are head and shoulders above IMI barrels…far better steel and boring
The Galil is a desert weapon and does well at that, the Valmet is an artic weapon and is superb in that environment.
current tarrif on a 62S is high…last one I owned sold for well over two thousand bones
company also brought in the first real bullbup in the early 80s
owned one, couldnt stand the racket beside my head
the Valmet M82 was really what started the renewed interest in Bullpups back in the 80s You see it in a cameo role in the 1st Terminator movie as Reece’s sidearm in his flashback to the world after the take over of the machines.