Bullets, bigbore, medbore, smallbore anyone?
Ok, obviously I am a newb here.
But I have been pouring over many of the various posts and I am absolutely fascinated with the great work of many talented enthusiasts that so generously share their talented experience and are so generous in documenting and discussing what I see as the cutting edge of recreational shooting sports of the future. Gentlemen, I want what you got and do what you do. I want to be a part of… I cant fake or pretend to having anything great or profound to contribute but I would like to start some discussion and postulate the following for your expert discussion and thoughts.
Bullets, slugs, casting lead, or boolits ive seen it referred. Big bore has been done in all forms from slug to roundball and even diablo conventional pellets. Cedrics videos which I love has helpped popularize long range, with Doug furthering the great works of those highly esteemed works of the previous masters like jack haley or even dennis quackenbush!
The casual observation has been the progression from .308 down to now is the .257 (“medbore”).
It seems that speed does play a large role as so eloquently someone else posted. Traditionally a major limit has been the physics of approaching mach speed and overcoming the poor ballistic coefficient of diablo pellets . Before the popularity of the .17 hmr, I had went through the trouble handloading the centrfire .17 rem cartridge for the Contender Pistol . Definately a trial in dexterity and vision seating that little pill on a necked down .223 case. I can imagine the pain casting tgesr things but wouldnt a .17 bullet of around 40 to 50 grns have a decent b.c. and good chance at being the hyper velocity rnd to consistiently achieve accuracy at mach speed?
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Hey guys thanks for being douche bags and leaving me out of the mix. What do I know about the 257 I only owned the first one ever made. Fuck me.
:rofl: Not gonna happen. :rofl: Doug just has so much on his plate! 🙁
DOUG,
1st. thanx very much for following and understanding the long range game with airguns. We are at a great point right now as we are just starting to bring some of that powder burner (PB) theory into airguns. And so far, taking and using the PB theory (bullets and twist rates) is why we r having so much success.
A 17 at that weight would in theory be very awesome and have a pretty high BC. And at this stage, THEORY is the problem. It would be soooooo nice if someone would throw together a 177 cal, high power airgun along with some SLEEK bullet molds in 177 and make them in a BOATTAIL design to test out for us…. Spare no expense.
Part of the problem with a bullet that heavy in 177 also would be having a barrel with a twist rate of 1-4 through 1-6 made……lol. Ok, 1-4, 1-6 twist rate was just a guess but im sure i’m not too far off…..lol.
So airguns of today simply copy what is already been done/available in he PB world only at much lower FPS due to the power plant of the modern airgun (compressed air of up to 4500 psi vs 50,000).
Part of the reason big bore airguns are so successful (all airguns) is that the projectiles stay BELOW supersonic. Now, subsonic (due to lower operating pressures and bullet weights) speeds combined with HIGH bc bullets such as 243, 257, 6.5mm, 7mm and 308 are why we can still reach out to 700 yards with much success. But even in these calibers, its been a stretch to get someone to even consider them in an airgun platform. This brings the late Jack Haley and some European guys to mind and I truly thank them for giving these wonderful calibers a go. We are just starting and if I had my way, along with plenty of money and a full time machinist, I would go at this full steam ahead and have something new for you guys about every month…lol. I have the ideas but just not the resources and that’s the part that sucks.
I agree with MIKE also, my 17 hmr takes a back seat to my 257. hell, even a 25 gr 17 bullet at 1000 fps would be pretty fun I think
DOUG NEEDS TO SPEED SHIT UP DAMNIT. I got projects to create and he is MY PERSONAL machinist……. :rofl:
I love my HMR but I gotta tell you, it takes a back seat to my .257 Talon/Dor. I shoot maybe 100-200 rounds of HMR a year, and literally thousands of .257. 😉
The problems you are going to get into with a .17 bullet in our guns are several.
One, Very difficult to cast for. Another, As Cedric pointed out, not enough area on the bullet to really get the velocity we want to be able to take advantage of the High BC.
But the biggie is that even if we could cast them well, and push them at a little higher velocity, there is the transition back thru ultra sonic in a fairly short distance, that would destabilize the bullet.
For it to work well for long range, we would need at least 1500 to 1600fps, and for 300 yard shooting, probably at least 1900. Just don’t’ think we have the technology to get there yet in the PCP air guns.
Would be fun though!!
I use Mr Hollow points bulltes , some like them some do not. I think if you cast your own you can be more selective and particular increasing accuracy. I do not have time and find his bullets in .45 plenty accurate for my 50 and 75 yard plinking!
You will find those going for real long distance shooting rarely use pellets and most cast.
One of the problems is that the smaller the bullet the harder it is to get fps. There is a smaller surface for the air to push on.
I think the problem is casting the bullet so small and this makes it harder to have more consistency between bullets thus shitty grouping would occur. I know I read that people wanted to shoot slugs in .22 but making the bullets was too hard. I had thought of your same vision as I shoot the .17 hmr myself thinking it would be a great round in an air rifle and wish someone would say it was possible
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No disrespect intended ‘RJ’…but can you post a few pics before anyone commits?
Thank you for your consideration in this matter….
Kindly ‘Ol Uncle Hoot: