New Slugs – 52 gr – whatever happened
SECoda wrote…
I have some new (different vendor) 52 grain solid slugs coming to try that are supposed to be extremely accurate out past 100 yards from a choked LW barrel. They are regular pistol slugs sized down to .2495 diameter from a cast of .2535 and are only 12 bhn. The do about 97 fpe but have a higher velocity. I will be testing them shortly.
Whatever happend wiht that ?
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I’m just fooling. There’s no way I’m getting into a group mold buy rodeo and design debate…
im in on it, as long as they arent ‘rings’ i need BULLETS like .22LR but maybe in 45 & 50 grains 🙂
How many slugs do you need to sell to make it worthwhile for an initial commitment? ❓
You guys are probably right. 52’s are the way to go. Who’s in on the new mold? I figure contributors get a discount until the mold is paid off.
Sure 😛 Actually I stayed with an 18″ barrel for dragging out in the field for yotes. The 62s are really perfect at 100 fpe but shez a nice short gun. 52s may be a marketing bonanza, though, especially with a stock Condor valve.
Good sell?
Let’s see, the 6,7,and 9 rings shoot well in properly powerful guns and so far, all the competitors have fallen short.
So, it’s my job to make new slugs instead of your job to tune up a bit? 😆 😆 😆
I just saw this. I received 20 of them from a guy that replicated the recipe supposedly of another guy on GTA Jerry knows of. They shot just a little worse then Eun Jins (about 2″ at 50 yards) so I didn’t pursue them.
We still need Jerry to whip up a batch of 52 grain Surefires although the 62 grain do pretty darn well.
Well said Jerry.
Syn,
We’re not talking politics so I didn’t mean to slap anyone around! 😆
You got my point though, making custom molds is a risk proposition. You pay for the mold and it either works or you wasted the money.
The molds we’re using came from the guy that makes the most expensive airguns made in this hemisphere. It doesn’t matter if you love the guns or hate them with a passion, his time has been valued by people with cash. (You can hate Cadillacs but try to get one cheap because you like Fords…).
Could I take what I think I know and have a commercial mold maker cut a mold? Yeah, so can anyone reading this thread! I’ll be happy to stand right here and mention the little changes that would make the new slug better… 😆 😆 😆 😆
Like most things, it’s easy to get advice but rare to find someone willing to share the risk of failure. Especially when that risk is technical and financial.
Well strap me over a barrel and slap some sense into me why don’t ya… 😆
A modded Condor sounds right though, the smaller slug would work in the stock config but anything heavier would be a stretch at the longer distances…
If I still had my AF rifle i’d be willing to pitch in some $$ for a mold but it’s long gone. 🙁
AG1, here is your chance, pitch in for the mold and you can buy them at will! 😉 Shit as hairbrained as it may appear on the surface if it flies right I think it would sell. Medium-heavies… 😯
Why oh why didn’t someone figure out that there is a huge market of the common Joe that would buy 50+ gr. The potential is probably as great as all 6-7-8-9 rings sold combined.
Barnes Pneumatic: http://www.glbarnes.com/
The Condor is a cheapo mass produced not very accurate noodle, comparatively speaking..
Buy some EuJins (sp) 45 grains…
Gunner,
There is no “someone who’s going to make “ring” slugs unless they brazenly steal the design. It would be similar to me selling Wokbutts here with a little thinner metal etc… These slugs didn’t just occur, they are the result of a development process that took time and money to complete. There’s no evidence to suggest that a 5 ring will work worth a crap…then again, there’s no evidence that says it won’t, cast some and find out. We made these slugs for guys that were over-powering the available ammo. The heavy slugs are NOT designed for the average guy/gun combo. While I appreciate the thought that an accurate 50gr slug that shoots better than the 43gr Eun Jin might sell a ton, my experience says…Bullshit! Everybody wants a choice that’s a touch more towards perfect but damn few ever actually order an expensive custom slug that’s a couple grains heavier or even 3 times more accurate than the cheap stuff they can get via over-night shipping. You might think a 5 ring would be a huge seller but the guy selling these things can tell you that he’s not convinced! That said, I’ll be happy to split the cost of a 5 ring mold with you and be proven wrong. It might take a couple of molds (like it did with the 6,7,8,9 ring molds) to get to an accurate mold we will put our name behind but the huge sales will cover that…
Syn,
You’re wrong, the ring slugs were designed specifically for the Condor. Gary built a .25 for the test program but it’s not a barrel size that matches any of his guns. We sell the slugs from .25 to .87 to all of his customers that don’t cast themselves and I’ll tell you right now, they don’t shoot the ring slugs, they have custom fitted ammo (I have a Barnes .25 and 5 custom slug designs for it…I’m familiar!). The 6,7 and 9 ring slugs purpose designed and made for the custom, high power Condor market. Before they were offered to the general public (you guys), they were tested in several iterations by guys with higher power Condors. The testers were chosen on the basis of reliability, the ability to shoot straight (as demonstrated here and elsewhere online), and percieved honesty. Tofazfou was one such tester and his input was critical to the slugs being what they are now. The fact that we can size these slugs up to .253 for the Korean guns is just iceing on the cake, they were made for Condors, pure and simple. Not a stock Condor but a Condor that had been modified for max performance. That’s our niche, stock guns can do what they do with Eun Jins or someone can share the risk (dollars) of buying a very expensive 5 ring mold…
How about some wire cutters? 😆 😆 😆
Shit if you have a lathe and a 0.02 accuracy grain scale you could machine the pellets down pretty easy…
I expect you will be putting the rifle in the case with the bottle removed. Mine barely fit in the case with the bottle on with a 24″ barrel, with a shroud these rifles get very long.
I wonder if the shorter and lighter 50 grain range slug would be less stable… I guess you could recess the butt end of the slug like a minnie ball… 😉
I’m interested to see Jerry’s response to your suggestion of a 5 ringer.
Get ready to be impressed with a 25 caliber and even the 30 grain pellets. I certainly was and I was very skeptical of it having enough power to do it right and it had more than enough! 😀
As I have written, I have a 52 grain 25 caliber ACP mold coming as I write this.
One of the members here, who I will not name, it is up to him if he choses to chime in, has just started using this mold and has been using a older mold casting the same bullet which is close to this design.
He gets 920 FPS with good accuracy I understand.
Now think about this, 920 FPS with a 52 grain round nose bullet.
I plugged that information into Handloads.com, with a 70 yard zero, it has a midrange trajectory hight of 2.5 inches and drops to 3 inches at 85 yards.
Now as far as point blank range is concerned, that is a minute of coyote load for those of us who don’t care what happens to the varmit after we pull the trigger.
I say that because it is a round nose bullet, it is not really a reliable killer as it does not have the shock needed to anchor a chest hit coyote consistantly, but growing up ranching I could care less where it dies, and being as the fur market will never come back, and having skinned hundreds of them, it doubles that feeling for me.
But back to this bullet. I think the 920 FPS can be improved upon, but first lets put this into perspective.
I have a Condor which is quite a gun, it shoots Kings at just under 1100 FPS and is in the mid 65 FPE level at the muzzle. The Condor shooting that 25 ACP bullet at 920 FPS does that same 65 FPE at 180 yards and at the muzzle is at 98 FPE.
Now use Tony’s valving, or Bods or RLairguns you will beat those speeds and up that FPE.
Jerry has shown us in recent years, and really paved the way it would seem for heavy slugs in the Condor. However remember that most thoughts and ideas have been tried before, sometimes they worked in the past with the equipment at hand, sometimes they did not.
Wth the barrels we have and the valving we have in the Condor I think it is a idea that is ripe with possibilties.
Regards,
Roachcreek
I just had a thought. What if I somehow built a clamp the shape of the 6 ring and then spun it with a drill and hacksawed off a ring ?
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Now see I was thinking you had those Barnes molds just waiting in the wings for an eager customer (it says the casts originally went from 40-80 grains on the old web site). I wonder if there is a way to accurately cut the back ring off of the 6 ringers? That would get the weight pretty close.