UK airgun limits are a good thing
The beauty of the UK limit is it levels the field for all competitors, we still get 50m / 65m shooters hitting a 25mm killzone with .177 at 780ft/ps there or abouts anyway. What i’d like to try is the type of shooting on offer in the states though, big bore at distances of over 100m outside with wind and gradient changes, we just don’t have those type of facilities, i can shoot a rimfire or centrefire on extended ranges but it’s not what you’d call a typical hunting scenario. Yeah i’m jealous of the facilities like the recent extreme benchrest in Arizona.
However, i really like the flexibility of the Airforce type airguns as i do like to fiddle with stuff, am i right in thinking the UK version is sold under Gunpower, but for the dedicated fiddler you can chop and change allsorts, from calibre to suppressed to bullpup with a starting rifle and adding as you go instead of buying the next “great rifle” they’re all great, they’re all pretty much better than ever.
Anyway, what’s the next big deal to come to airgunning , I’m thinking something based on linear magnets and magic stuff like that.
I’d like to ask a favour, what would be my best Airforce rifle to start with prior to fiddling.
nice to meet you guys anyway
Gaz
All Replies
if you think your laws are normal, this is what the nanny state says in the uk
Arrow UK Airgun Law
Airguns in the UK are subject to the firearms acts, under the Firearms (Dangerous air weapons) rules 1969 they are classified as low powered Air Weapons and as such they are restricted to a maximum power of 12 foot pounds energy for a rifle and 6 foot pounds energy for a pistol. Air rifles above 12ft/lbs are classified as a Section 1 Firearm and requires a licence (FAC) otherwise known as a firearms certificate, and an Air pistol above 6ftlb is a prohibited weapon.
UK Legal Limit
To calculate the power of an airgun you need to use a chronograph to measure the speed of the pellet (in feet per second) when fired, and you need to know the weight of the pellet in grains. Once you have that information you perform the following calculation:- speed(ft/sec) X speed(ft/sec) X weight(grains) /450240
This gives you the result in foot pounds force (ftlb).
As mentioned the legal maximum for an unlicensed air rifle is 12 ftlb which from changing round the above formula, gives the approximate values as follows:-
A .22 pellet weighing 14.4 grains, maximum permissible speed is 612 ft/sec
A .177 pellet weighing 7.9 grains, maximum permissible speed is 826 ft/sec
The corresponding figures for a pistol are 433 ft/sec for a .22 and 584 ft/sec for a .177
The pellet weights used in the above calculation are typical weights for the sizes of pellet but you must always check the actual weight of your pellet before performing your own calculation.
Airgun Quarry
The following pests are considered suitable for controlling using a sub-12 ftlb Airgun.
BIRDS: (covered by the open general licences) crows, rooks, jackdaws, magpies, jays, wood pigeon, collared doves, and feral pigeons.
MAMMALS: brown rats, grey squirrels, stoats, mink and rabbits.
Information sheet on general licences for the control of certain bird species in the UK please click here to read
Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981
All bird and animals are protected by law. Certain species are classified as pests or vermin and only these species can be legitimately shot and then only by authorised persons. An Authorised Person is someone who has the proper permission from the land owner to control pests on that land. © Airgunforum.co.uk
Offence Penalties
The Penalties for breaking current UK firearms laws with Airguns are as follows:-
Carrying a loaded Air-weapon in a public place 6 months imprisonment and / or £5,000 fine.
Trespassing with an air weapon 3 months imprisonment and / or £2,500 fine.
Trespassing on private land with an air weapon 3 months imprisonment and / or £2,500 fine.
Possessing or using an air weapon if sentenced to 3 months or more in custody 3 months imprisonment and / or £2,500 fine.
In addition if original sentence up to 3 years 5 year ban on use of firearms.
Or if for 3 years or more Life ban on use of firearms.
Killing or injuring any bird or protected animal unless authorised £5,000 fine.
Firing an air weapon within 15m / 50ft of a public highway £1,000 fine.
Selling or hiring air weapon or ammunition to person under 17 6 months imprisonment and / or £5,000 fine.
Making a gift of air weapon or ammunition to person under 14 £1,000 fine.
Having air weapon or ammunition with intent to damage property 10 years imprisonment.
Having air weapon with intent to endanger life Life imprisonment and / or appropriate fine.
Using air weapon to resist or prevent arrest Life imprisonment and / or appropriate fine.
Threatening others with an air weapon (even if unloaded) to cause them to fear unlawful violence 10 years imprisonment and / or appropriate fine.
Not forgetting the chance of being shot and killed by the police should you not obey instructions when challenged by them, they cannot tell if you have just an airgun or a more lethal firearm so will treat all arms as lethal and respond accordingly.
Civil Law
It should be born in mind by every airgun shooter that the unexpected could happen and they could find themselves facing a civil action for damage to property or even injury to persons or livestock. Every airgun shooter should have Third Party Public Liability Insurance before venturing out of doors, and joining one of the bodies representing shooters interests is the best way to achieve this.
Following the enactment of the Violent Crime Reduction Act 2006, listed below are the current regulations relating to the purchase, ownership, sale and possession of airguns and ammunition.
Persons under the age of 14:
1) No person under the age of 14 may purchase, hire or be given an airgun or ammunition.
2) A person under the age of 14 must at all times when shooting be supervised by a person over the age of 21.
Persons over the age of 14 but under 18:
1) No person under the age of 18 may purchase, hire or be given an airgun or ammunition.
2) A person in this age group may shoot unsupervised on private land with the permission of the landowner but must be supervised by somebody over the age of 21 if in a public place.
It should be noted that this means that a person aged seventeen and a half who may have a driving licence cannot take an air rifle from home to his club to shoot unless the gun is possessed by somebody over the age of eighteen or the seventeen and a half-year old is supervised by a person over the age of twenty-one.
Persons over the age of 18:
A person over the age of eighteen can buy an airgun and pellets and use them unsupervised.
General Restrictions:
1) It is an offence to have an airgun in a public place “without good reason”, the proof being the responsibility of the possessor.
2) It is an offence to discharge a firearm within fifty feet of the centre of a highway, if doing so would cause a nuisance or endangering the public
3) When shooting over private land it is an offence for the pellet to go beyond the boundary of the premises on which the gun is being used unless there is permission from the adjoining landowner.
4) Persons who by way of trade deal in airguns, pressure bearing parts or component parts must be a Registered Firearms Dealer and any transaction must be face-to-face. Ammunition for airguns may continue to be sold by post.
Exceptions:
1) It is not an offence for a person to have with him an airgun or ammunition whilst being a member of a Home Office Approved Club in connection with target practice.
2) Air rifles with a muzzle energy in excess of 12 foot pounds (which require licensing) are not subject to the general restrictions listed above.
3) An “airgun” with the kinetic energy of less than one joule is considered a toy and is therefore not covered by the above restrictions but may be considered a realistic imitation firearm (if it looks like a gun). The sale of realistic imitation firearms is now banned with one or two minor exceptions, mainly for historical re-enactment, museums and television/film/theatrical performances or as a recognized member of an airsoft site affiliated to the Association of British AirSoft. © Airgunforum.co.uk
Crime and Security Bill:
Offence of allowing minors access to air rifles/pistols, The Firearms Act 1968 is amended as follows.
Failing to prevent minors from having air rifles/pistols.
It is an offence for a person in possession of an air rifle/pistol to fail to take reasonable precautions to prevent any persons under the age of 18 from having the air rifle/pistol with him.
and if your over the limit you’ve had it
well guys i think your laws are hot air and bullshit that are too easily manipulated with gobbledygook.
considering your options in the states i am still puzzled as to why you would purchase very expensive airguns when firearms are so readily available and so cheap, cheap ammo too. 22 rimfire slightly less power than the texan and other similar rifles, but a fraction of the cost, doesn’t make sense.
i know what i like and what i’ll spend my cash on. i’ll wait till easter and get the impact i think,
AF are simple, no nonsense and i like the the features overall but it is let down by poor build quality, which is why i would fettle and tinker with it, replace / upgrade parts etc. as long as you get the chrony out to check its fine, no problem
lastly lerker are all american police as much a bigot as you are ?
Horus,
You nailed that one.
A friend of mine rents a house to a white guy and It got raided by homeland dicks without warrant looking for a black man that supposedly lives there. He never had lived there and no connection to the renter. Oh NO MATTER, they continued to search the whole house and personal belongings saying they were searching for guns. There weren’t any. But NO MATTER, because due to the phony patriot act they can search anywhere without warrant or cause. Apparently there is no legal recourse for unwarranted invasion of privacy anymore.
In US we DO NOT have a gun problem ❗
We do have a people problem ❗
We have a bunch of idiots that never spanked their brats and let them be indoctrinated by radical liberals, progressives, and violent religions.
We have those spoiled brats in gov’t failing to preserve a controlled immigration.
We have millions of illegals not paying taxes but getting free education, free health care, free food, free clothing, etc.
What we need is more guns in all public places so we can take out the bezerkers before they murder us in mass.
But we still have that brat problem that needs re-educated before they are allowed to carry those scarry weapons of self defense.
P.S.
Terrorist don’t want the average citizen to carry weapons ❗
Corrupt politicians don’t want the average citizen to carry weapons ❗
Teachers don’t want our spoiled brats to carry weapons ❓ Well, sure they are not being well educated ❗
Personally, I don’t think anyone under the age of 25 should be allowed to carry weapons in public.
sounds just like the uk,,, but don’t worry im sure Obama will get around to airguns before long,, at least you fellas have some right left,, but there sneaky like when they sneaked the patriot act in, we have similar laws to PROTECT us in uk,, its all total propaganda bullshit of the highest order,, staged events so they have fuel to try to ban something or go to war or whatever and its us poor twats who have to do the fighting and dying while they count there cash,,,, 👿
Federal vs states law on airguns
http://talonairgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2536#p22080
“UK airgun limits are a good thing”
Because “The beauty of the UK limit is it levels the field for all competitors…..”
Then you change the subject subject to wanting info on which AF rifle to start fiddling with.
I was expecting to discuss why you think “UK airgun limits are a good thing” but you quickly changed to wanting to know which AF rifle you should start fiddling with as you like to fiddle.
OK, an AF Talon .177 will require the most fiddling to get to your 100m goal.
Do you want something the authorities could spot test one day and you can swap out the parts in a few hours and have a covert illegal weapon on hand for emergency ❓
My suggestion would be to immigrate to US where we still have some rights that make you jealous. Just don’t get in trouble with your law and then try to immigrate.
finally, you reckon the talon would be best, ok, at uk settings you reckon a 177 would be able to punch paper at 100m, hmmmm i doubt that mate, if i’m wrong then i would take your advice and purchase the uk model, not sure which one it is as they seem to have different names but i’ll certainly look for it when i go to the gunshop.
as i said before if i wanted outright power only i would get a section 1 and buy whatever i wanted, we dont have the facilities across the uk to use that kind of rifle, you would need to join a club, if you had a closed certificate you may only use it at the club, no where else.
an adjustable rifle on a section 1 is the same.
an adjustable rifle on a fixed power setting offers the best of both worlds and should i decide to go the firearms route at a later date it’s so much cheaper to upgrade the starting rifle with ” go faster stripes”
purchase a daystate pulsar 12ft/lbs approx 1600 pounds, convert to fac additional 300 pounds ridiculous the AF platform offers cheaper alternatives and the multi calibre option i like, whereas the daystate offers flexible power settings only
as for level playing field – if your shooting at the edge of your capability with a low calibre rifle, wind affects the accuracy more than a larger calibre does
at a blanket setting of 12ft/lbs the 177 comes into its own as the 25 wont reach the target
its hard to put across my point to someone who is to self opinionated to recognise when your wrong as are your liberal gunlaws. lastly i agree people do kill people with guns, in the uk you go home with a blackeye and maybe a bust lip, in the states you go to heaven……..
“UK airgun limits are a good thing”
Because “The beauty of the UK limit is it levels the field for all competitors…..”
Then you change the subject subject to wanting info on which AF rifle to start fiddling with.
I was expecting to discuss why you think “UK airgun limits are a good thing” but you quickly changed to wanting to know which AF rifle you should start fiddling with as you like to fiddle.
OK, an AF Talon .177 will require the most fiddling to get to your 100m goal.
Do you want something the authorities could spot test one day and you can swap out the parts in a few hours and have a covert illegal weapon on hand for emergency ❓
My suggestion would be to immigrate to US where we still have some rights that make you jealous. Just don’t get in trouble with your law and then try to immigrate.
As an interesting side note….. Regarding the American constitutional second amendment rights. Strangely enough , there is a bit of irony in the fact that while firearms are heavily regulated by many national and regional laws the second amendment none the less provides the individual the right to own and posess a firearm. Technically, by the virtue of being an air powered arm, airguns in the United States are exempt from many of the regulations, restrictions or registration that firearm s must adhere,,,, HOWEVER, there exsist no mandate or right that allows for a citizen to own an airgun of any form. In otherwords the lawmakers and politicians can easily legislate away airguns or mandate certain power restrictions here in the states because the right to bear arms is defined as firearms not airguns , not swords nor thermonuclear device They could easily put limits on airguns without even any legislative oversight or representation. Some off the wall entity of the Fed such as the Surgeon General or Consumer Product Safety Commision could deem Airguns exceeding the 12FtLb limit a safety or public health threat and issue a notice or proposal for rulemaking to be published in the federal registry and no more airguns .
i would like an AF model as they are great to fiddle and work on, my ideal rifle is the new FX impact, multiple calibres and power settings, 700+ shots at 12ft/lbs
i could have 177 for paper punching, 22 for the tree rats and 25 for the bunnies. thing is for all this i would be looking at 2000 pounds plus, yes i get great build quality and the the pedigree that FX brings but mate thats expensive, the AF range offer multi calibre options in the uk under gunpower, cost about 600 pounds and then additional barrels a fraction of a smooth twist, no additional pellet probes needed, maybe it’s not as quick to change out as the impact but it offers the flexibility i ‘m looking for, my point seems to be lost but i think 12ft/lbs is adequate for the uk market to plink with, to target shoot with and once a high degree of accuracy has been achieved hunt with, how can an air rifle that produces more power than a handgun not be classed as a firearm, why is a 22 rimfire a firearm when an AF texan isn’t and yet the AF produces considerably more energy.
i’ve been lucky to have travelled to the states on a number of occasions and i loved it. but i was on holiday and living there would be different obviously, too many nutters with firearms legal or otherwise, kids killing kids, killing themselves, dreadful accidents with unsecured handguns and nightmare multiple murders by children. you say “we didnt, haven’t, couldn’t” of course you could it’s called responsible parenting and if you get that wrong early well the results are there for all to see.
this isnt a place to discuss your shortfalls in being parents, and you need to get rid of the chip on your shoulder fellah
“UK airgun limits are a good thing”
Because “The beauty of the UK limit is it levels the field for all competitors…..”
Then you change the subject subject to wanting info on which AF rifle to start fiddling with.
I was expecting to discuss why you think “UK airgun limits are a good thing” but you quickly changed to wanting to know which AF rifle you should start fiddling with as you like to fiddle.
OK, an AF Talon .177 will require the most fiddling to get to your 100m goal.
Do you want something the authorities could spot test one day and you can swap out the parts in a few hours and have a covert illegal weapon on hand for emergency ❓
My suggestion would be to immigrate to US where we still have some rights that make you jealous. Just don’t get in trouble with your law and then try to immigrate.
As an interesting side note….. Regarding the American constitutional second amendment rights. Strangely enough , there is a bit of irony in the fact that while firearms are heavily regulated by many national and regional laws the second amendment none the less provides the individual the right to own and posess a firearm. Technically, by the virtue of being an air powered arm, airguns in the United States are exempt from many of the regulations, restrictions or registration that firearm s must adhere,,,, HOWEVER, there exsist no mandate or right that allows for a citizen to own an airgun of any form. In otherwords the lawmakers and politicians can easily legislate away airguns or mandate certain power restrictions here in the states because the right to bear arms is defined as firearms not airguns , not swords nor thermonuclear device They could easily put limits on airguns without even any legislative oversight or representation. Some off the wall entity of the Fed such as the Surgeon General or Consumer Product Safety Commision could deem Airguns exceeding the 12FtLb limit a safety or public health threat and issue a notice or proposal for rulemaking to be published in the federal registry and no more airguns .
Getting back on topic
“UK airgun limits are a good thing”
Because “The beauty of the UK limit is it levels the field for all competitors…..”
Then you change the subject subject to wanting info on which AF rifle to start fiddling with.
I was expecting to discuss why you think “UK airgun limits are a good thing” but you quickly changed to wanting to know which AF rifle you should start fiddling with as you like to fiddle.
OK, an AF Talon .177 will require the most fiddling to get to your 100m goal.
Do you want something the authorities could spot test one day and you can swap out the parts in a few hours and have a covert illegal weapon on hand for emergency ❓
My suggestion would be to immigrate to US where we still have some rights that make you jealous. Just don’t get in trouble with your law and then try to immigrate.
i agree horus.
i believe we will follow what’s happened in scotland too fellah, but like you also say it means getting your gun checked, will it be random chrony tests, will it need to be in a gunsafe like section 1 or just in a secure place ( wardrobe / cupboard ) like now, i cant see it being used to raise money but it will give police the right to search your property possibly without a search warrant, which i find more of an invasion of privacy, maybe lerker could throw some of his experience and knowledge to let us know what he thinks of the search suggestion.
lerker, fellah you come across as paranoid mate and your obviously not used to people disagreeing with you, well personaly i wouldnt trust someone like you with an attitude like that to have a cap gun never mind a handgun
i dont think our “low” limits should raise as for what we are able to shoot the power is adequate providing you have good shot placement. kill pests and vermin just dont be cruel when you do it, head shots. i think the bigger calibres offer more of a challenge as they seem to have more of a report similar to perhaps a 4/10. add the longer reach offered because of the obvious hike in power together with the heavier calibre, like i said we just dont have those sort of facilities. it would be great but we dont.
of course its a genuine thread its about airgun comparisons in different countries with different views and different laws, lerker you come across as a bit thick too
Give gaz a couple years away from his high school and/or liberal college teachers and his/her tone will change.
Horus, I’ m really sorry to hear about Scotland. It’s a program of disarming the public as a dictator or elite group prepare to take full control and keep people enslaved to inflationary events that they have no control over.
Hell we cant trust the voting machines in US as a few years ago the CEO of DeBold let it slip that he could deliver the election to the Repuklicans. My state dumped the DeBold machines but the cat was already out of the bag. The Repukes didn’t win that year but it really doesn’t matter because big brother controls all politicians except Maybe not Trump. I fear for our brothers in the UK and all the rest of the world. Our hearts are as strong as ever but our gov’t has weakened our military somewhat. We may have to play our Trump Cards in the next few years.
gaz, you say you want to know about jacking up the power because you read about the US ❓
Go ahead and blame us. We hear it all the time.
So is this topic a phony saying your low power is what we should change to :rofl:
Or are you being a little deceptive ❓
I live in the uk and theres nothing good about a bunch of clowns in downing street restricting air rifles to 12 ftlbs, saying its good is like adding to more restrictions,, like in Scotland just over the border from me there putting ALL airguns on fac next year, so most people who have no access to private land cant have air rifles,,,
, makes my blood boil how the government take anything off the public that they can potentially defend themselves with,,
at a time when people should be defending themselves against this isis lot!
in the words of the late great Charlton Heston,,yes you can have my rifle,, 😈 when you pry it from of my cold dead hands!!
hi lerker
my my you rant a bit don’t you, glad i’m in the uk you’d be up and shouting waving your gun about no doubt.
as a former police officer you surprise me with some of your views regarding immigration and the lack of status quo in your own country, as for your expertise in world politics i’m hardly one to argue as i know and coudln’t give a toss about any of it, i am that insignificant, i love to talk about guns and how well they perform.
is it better to have a FAC rated rifle costing thousands of pounds just for the power or is it better to get a cheap rimfire, you need the same licence for each, in fact why not get a .308 centrefire while your at it. because there’s no point for the places you can use them.
as for why would i want to know how to ramp up a pcp, dont be ridiculous you silly man, have you heard of you tube !!!!
i think some of your outdated and unwarranted comments are bang out of order, america isn’t viewed with a cape attatched like some sort of superhero,
as for your comments about coming to the worlds rescue over and over again, on behalf of all mankind thanks
as for the uk having a people problem, of course we do, we are multi cultural, multi ethical, multi religous and try as we might sometimes we dont get on, so we’ll kick the shit out of each other there and then, and that’s that amte to be honest
gaz,
I’m sure it’s hard for people not from here to fathom the depth of the statement that
Guns don’t kill people, PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE
There are many times more stabbings than shootings so should the world outlaw sharp or pointy things.
Many more people are killed in hospitals by medical malpractice than by guns so should we outlaw hospitals and doctors ❓
Having been a qualified Ohio Peace Officer (police officer), I fully understood the most important function of the job is prevention of crime through visibility.
Unfortunately very little of our taxes go toward police departments and as you may realize we have much more area to cover than many euro communities.
I believe that we are at a turning point in this country as witnessed by many more people obtaining concealed carry permits. That is not the problem but a symptom of need of protection from millions of under privileged illegal immigrants, and the world problem of radical religions that believe piece can only happen when they have converted or murdered everyone else.
We have tried to accommodate many other peoples but the radicals and criminals have pushed us nearly to our limit.
Our legal immagrants have suffered more than the silent majority but are better off than they were in there home countries.
Some dark days are coming for corrupt politicians, other criminals, and the murdering radicals. We will no doubt try to help you other countries again but you best look out for yourselve as we may be to busy for a few years.
Why are you wanting to know how to over power a 12 foot pound air rifle ❓ v
Don’t you realize that may be illegal in your country ❓
I know that you are concerned and rightfully so.
We will be capable to take care of our “people” problem while other countries can only hope to hide and wait for US to come to their aid AGAIN.
AGAIN, we have a people problem NOT A GUN PROBLEM where as you have Both A PEOPLE AND A LACK OF GUNS PROBLEM
🙄
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Gaz , regardless who is right or who is wrong about our views on airguns and the power of ft/pounds it is personnel to the person who is able to
own an airgun in their country and the limits their country places on them . Some countries have no limits at all and you can shoot the largest
caliber with the best moderator and you never have to be limited or registered . We as shooters who love the sport of shooting should be able
to respect and embrace each other and not attack each other over stupid indifferences on what we believe , that is how people become radicals
and wars are started . At times even I am guilty of over expressing myself , I hope this isn’t one of those times .
FROM : THE BIRDMAN