Virgin & length
🙄 New guy with lot’s of questions. Back ground been a power burner for years but new to PCP. In line to have Tony build me a full house 25 Condor and next a 22 Condor/Talon.
Wants/questions: 1. NO noise but may have that covered with my order 2. Accuracy of coarse but is a 100 yard sparrow killer asking too much? 3. Barrel length 24″s with a shroud is really too long for me, Tony’s 21″ is better butttt 21-18″ looks better to me. Will I lose out much going to the 18″ish barrel considering my 100 yard desires? 4. FX ST barrel really sounds like it may be a good option to play with, “shoots very very good” what does that really mean, 1/2″, 1/8″ 1/16″ at 50 yards?
Enough for my first post here. Lot’s of good information here. Good to be onboard but my wife thinks it’s just another place to take me away from my “honey does”…. Too many hobbies and not enough time..glad I’m retired… 😀
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I’m learning guys… 😯 got my eyes opened a bit. Thanks for all the information and the group photo’s. I’ve got my work cutout ahead but looks like fun times. You’re right I’m hooked and just getting started. 😈
Powderburner,
Well that is better. But like you say they are cherry picked groups, as if we don’t all do that.
But if you ask just about anyone who has a Edgun, FX Royale, AA S410 or a Daystate, the reason they have it is because they shoot better than a Condor and a SS.
I don’t mean to belittle your/our rifles, it is just that they are in fact $500.00 Air Rifles.
When you spend 3 times more than that, besides exposing your addiction 😆 , you do get a considerably better shooting gun. And by that I mean a gun that gives you that first shot on the target, not something you have to screw with and rezero constantly as it changes it zero for some unknown reason whether its frame flex or pressure changes or the frame getting dirty inside.
My Airforce guns do certain things that other air guns will not, like shoot cast bullets and shoot them with power for a long ways out.
As far as trying to get them to be something they are not. Give me a break, add on butt plates, angled tank adapters, trigger guards, regulators, ETACs, LDC’s, lasers, one piece valve stems, trirails , triggershoes, bipod adapters perhaps were making them something they were not to be, or should have been, a sows ear conspiracy if you will? I thought that was the reason for owning one, and the reason others sell parts for them.
It is just when I pick up my FX Royale and head out the door, I don’t need to check the zero at the upper range before my daily hunt, I know that it is going to be dead on every damn time, if I miss it is me not the rifle and that is refreshing after using Condors and Talons SS that have not been for a couple of years.
Regards,
Roachcreek
Not trying to show any kind of best groups RC, just what the gun would do dragging it out and shooting it without tuneing or messing with it, and this is with crosman Hollow point pellets, Jsb’s will shoot better of course, i can go and shoot 36 yards, and give you some ragged hole’s with the cheap pellets.
but here are some more groups that maybe wont embarrass any one ,these are with a little work and making sure gun was in the tune.
Kodiaks at 50
crosman hp 10 shots at 50
JSB 14 g at 100 , 5 shots
cross premier 10 shots at 50
JSB 14 grain 50 yards
cross premier 50 yards
36 yard target 18 grain JSB , one shot each bull
Powderburner,
I have had three AF rifles, and many mods on all of them.
M AA S410 shot consistantly better than they did, my FX Royale out shoots the AA S410.
I was shooting today in the wind just leveling a different scope on the Royale, I was getting groups in the .17 to .28 range at 36 yards, shorter distance know, but they don’t grow much more at 50 yards.
I have a FX Royale 500 coming on Wednesday, but all my European guns shot considerably better than the groups you have posted. If my 500 shot like that I would be sorely disapoined.
I don’t mean to embarass you or demean you, and brand loyality is a wonderful thing, as longyou don’t get sand in your hair. I suspect your a very good shot, you just need to get out more and try more air rifles. 😛
Regards,
Roachcreek
any way here is 7 groups straight out of the safe , gun is set up for 10 m shooting in the house, shot one time at 36 yards to make sure how far high to aim , then let a 50 yard group go on an old target,
first 2 shots touched, third out of group fourth back in group , fifth way out of group, not to bad. (this is the left target)
now put up new target, 2nd group not too bad then the groups open up from there for the 3 rd 4th and 5th group, so i knew the psi in the tank would be pretty far off where the tune was for decent accuracy.
went in only had 1000 to 1100 in tank, filled to 1800 , took one shot, then took the next 3, 5 shot groups 1st second and 3rd on lower set in second target.1st and 3rd groups measure .438 , this is with crosman premier hollow point from wal mart. (JSB’s will shoot better), vel was in the 840’s after filling to 1800.
Any way what does all the mean , was just wondering what the gun would shoot like just taking it out of the safe and shooting some groups, not to bad if i say so myself,
And RC,
i have no dought that the more expensive guns are finer quality, you cant compare aluminum and plastic, to fine wood, but what i am saying is the air force ( or more to the point MY AIRFORCE) will shoot right along with , or better ? ,than the high dollar guns , and if someone wanted to, they could get one shooting the same way. 😉
all groups 50 yards,
this is a test to see ;how my condor will shoot straight out of the safe, no tuneing, have not shot it in a couple of weeks.
Powder Burner, evidently you have never shot a Daystate, FX or a AA S410/510, the Condor is a fine $500 rifle, but it will never match up to a quality european gun.
About frame flex,Woks grip conversion will help, the Maddog stocks will take most of it out.
Regards,
Roachcreek
Your right, i was being conservative 🙂 from reading about the TTT
and talking about easier achieveable groups.
if you want my personal best then at 50 yards with my condor it is .221” 5 shot groups, and .700” 5 shot at 100, and 3 of the 5 shots at 100 yards on 2 of my groups were in .350 ”
I have only shot 8 groups at 100 yards and 4 of them were under 1”, of course this is with my gun tuned and ready.i would say this is pretty good potential.
But my main point is that it will take breaking in and tuneing to get the best results 😉
and without super tuneing i can ususally see 2 or 3 shots touching at 50 with the others spreading out to still under 3/4″ or 1 ” .
LIke if i pick up my gun right now, and i havent touched it for a while , and see what it will print at 50 yards. well ok i am going to do this just for kicks. will be back
I don’t know about your estimations about group size from a tuned T/T gun powder… if you’re not getting jagged one hollers at 35 yards then I believe you’re shooting a pellet the barrel dose not agree with as well as your not doing your part on the trigger end of things.
these air rifles are very accrete when you do your part right out of the factory, let alone after Tony get his magic paws on it and gets everything with the valve, tophat and preload wheel balanced. when you get it your not going to want to adjust anything! just fill and shoot.
the fame flex will be your biggest enemy, especially coming from a p/b background were you pull the rifle to your shoulder and lock it in. the a/f’s need a very light shouldering as well as just support from your lead hand.
i think there are a few threads in the quick reference section about frame flex, and I know there are quite a few in other parts of the form, search for them and do a bit of reading to get a better understanding of the dreadful frame flex.
btw – Welcome to the mad house!
Your condor can out shoot the European guns , but it will take allot of tuning and allot of work. but with a little bit of work it can shoot with them or close, but just out of the box tuned tony gun you should be well pleased. i’m talking les than 1/2” at 35 and under an 1” at 50 and under 2” at 100.
bad thing about the air force is also the good part, huge air supply and power potential, at full power you will not get full accuracy , but you can get 1/4” at 50 and smaller and well under 1” at 100 yards , but only in a super tuned gun,
i have had a blast with my condor and have no intentions of selling it to go to any higher dollar gun, and i haven’t even put a regulator on it yet.
It is a bit frustrating when the tune changes, mostly i think with the weather cold to hot, but it usually only take s a slight power wheel adjustment and top hat adjustment to get it back.
if you like tinkering your right at home with the air force, but if you get frustrated easily, better get some decaf. 🙂
Hey guys thanks for the input. Got the air supply covered with a Great White set up. would like to say Joe Brancato at Air Tanks for Sale .com was great to deal with even I did not really know what I needed. He was honest and helpful. Tony’s cool too…
AS for ergonomics I’ve tried Tony’s tank adapter and it has helped alot. Just have to find the just right scope mounts. A cheek piece I’ll make to fit me better.
Now the big question.. ❓ frameflex..where’s it going to happen? Big air bottle hanging of the assend of the rifle? Got to be an easy fix for this. Or is the barrel bushings the real problem. Not a free floating barrel for sure. As for all that power, I thought you could dial it down with the magic knob on the side of the AirForce frame. Which brings up another question.. Can the Condor set up be dialed down to equal the air usage of a Talon and would not this help on the over powering of the pellets and bring accuracy in tighter?
The idea of a US gun outshinning the high dollar guns from Europe get’s my jucies flowing. Of course I may wind up with twice as much money in ths US rifle but who’s counting. If Tony’s as good as everybody says I’m well on my way… I just need to know if it is possibe or do I need to tone down my expectations 😥 .
As for more PCP guns I’m already on my way….. 😀
When I’m done I expect me to be the limiting factor in how good my rifle shoot NOT the gun it’s self 😆 I don’t mind blaming myself for that miss.
Your gonna love your gun from Talon Tunes he does a great job.
There are a lot of advantages in using the AF gun. The problems is many guys try to make them something they were never meant to be.
When you get your gun from Tony you will have an accurate, powerful take down rifle that will give you a lot of choices as to caliber and power.
Another thing to keep in mind is you will never have just one airgun. Once you get one your gonna want more 😀
1Oldguy2,
Welcome aboard, and to answer some of your questions, here are my opinions, but remember opinions are like assholes, everybody has one.
Quiet, Yes with your order you will get real quiet.
A 100 yard sparrow gun, probably not the ideal platform. THe airForce rifles system will yield you lots of power, but this does not usually translate to pristine 100 yard accuracy. Things like ergonomics, frameflex are working against you.
A Daystate, FX Royale or a Rapid are inherently more accurate for that task.
Sort of like a Ford 429 in a Pinto, you will be all over a 911 Porsche until that first corner.
The AF platform has a great barrel in the LW as a general rule, but like that little Pinto it is a low cost item with a big power plant. Shoot the gun a lot before you jump into the SlowTwist barrel, I have both as some do here, both are accurate barrels, the question is whether the AF platforms limitations will allow you to take adbvantage of what the ST barrel offers and whether that money will be better spent elsewhere.
A 18 inch barrel can give you all the power you need for a Condor, it will just use more air, remember you need to stay under the speed of sound to stay accurate with the Diablo designed pellets we use, the Condor platform will get you to that point with 18 inch barrel.
Regards,
Roachcreek
:tag:
Buying a Tony tuned AF gun is about as good as it gets. There are many variables. There are guys here who amaze me with their consistent accuracy. They hit all kinds of small targets, (living and not), at long ranges. It’s really up to you. How much do you care to practice and experiment and are your targets within your range. In other words, find your furthest distance that you are accurate and then start moving out. Shoot lots of pellets. Ask questions and have fun. 😀
Figure out your air supply. That .25 will require more than a hand pump. 😉
You’re gonna get so hooked! 😎
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not cherry picked at all,
just groups when i had kept the gun in it’s tune. I dont have to spend $ 1500 to get good groups. And no it will not shoot that tight over a longer shot string with varying tank pressure. but 10 shots in 3/8″ at 50 yards ?? not uncommon , cant do it every time, but not uncommon.
This is all with a non regulated gun . that i have $450 in , with a $100 BSA 4×12 scope on it.
Show me some groups that are $1000 to $1500 dollars better than the groups that i have just posted.