Flat shoting combo SR12 reticle and 25 acp cast bullet
I have been working with Handloads.com and Hawke Ballistic calculator for a good coyote size hunting zero.
I choose a somewhat modest 910 FPS altho I have hit as high as 945 FPS.
With a 80 yard zero I have a aiming point for 55 70 and 80 yards, and as you can see it very flat shooting at those distances.
At 185 yards, the furtherest aiming point, the bullets is still traveling with the same energy and veleocity as the 25 ACP has at the muzzle.
At 200 yards it is the equivilant of a 25 King at 1050FPS at the muzzle.
Sorry for the poor quailty photo’s I am computer illerate when it comes to posting site info.
These are in ten yard intervals out to 100 yards.
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When I keep the weight of the bullet down to around 30 grains so the length of the bullet was short things were ok . I tried a few different diameters and it is such a critical thing with that much surface that it was not worth the effort IMO . That is why bench rest shooters spend the money they do for swag dies that win the matches . Cast bullets with smaller bearing surfaces are much more for giving . And yes you can have a rear wast bore riding bullet . But then you have a propeller on the end of the bullet IMO . Marvin
I thought there would be problems with the bearing surface. I wonder if a hollow base using a smaller dia would work? Still the bearing surface problem though. I guess it needs a waist to reduce the bearing surface.
Wasn’t there someone..I think the pellet man that was time swaging
pellets.at one time?
Remember petroleum products and HPA do not mix . Marvin
Marvin,
I see that the Ranch Dog fellow sprays with WD-40 to size with and then washes it off and applies ALox after the sizing.
Perhaps I am using too much Moly, I spray them from every angle to assure coverage, as if I were painting.
I will try the light coating.
Regards,
Roachcreek
I tried swaging for the 25 condor . And the results were poor . Had to use 5-6 bhn lead for the die to hold up to the pressure over time . With all the bearing surface and the speed the bullets were going the shearing could not be controlled and accuracy was not consistent . As far as the molly lube goes I use it sparingly . RC the bullets I sent you had as heavy a layer of molly that I apply . They had been sprayed and resized but not sprayed with a light coat again . It does not take much . And the dry slide that I apply to the barrel after cleaning is there for the first bullet to push toward the muzzle . And what little molly that is on the bullet that is deposited in the barrel is there for the next bullet . Just a little lube can go a long ways . IMO Marvin
JDNC,
I am using 40-1, it was some alloy I made up to get heavier, softer bullets for the Ranger 45. When I order alloy again, most of it will be 20-1 with perhaps a few pounds of either #2 alloy or Rotomeatals hard cast blend to harden up my alloy
I have tried Johnsons paste wax, it works great on the 45 Ranger, but seem to get build up in my25 bore which eventually degrades accuracy.
I am thinking SPG might work wonders or a blend of parafin or beeswax and olive oil and a little breakfree. As you know black powder fouling and petroleum products will make asphalt in your barrel, but without heat or the chemicals involved in Black powder, we can add petroleum products so maybe some vaseline would help. The good thing about Moly is it is not messy, and the rest of this stuff certainly is.
I am still getting flyers tho, and shoot 6 shots and measure the best 5, which gives tight groups, but I have to say I am putting a lot of hope out there on the sizer dies coming from Lee. Even the flyers would stay on a coyotes rib cage at 100 yard tho.
And being as they are hard to chamber without lube, if I use a tool to do it, I deform the bases and flyers result. With lube, they do not require a chambering tool, but some are still just hard to push in.
One thing I have not spent much time writing about, is the great penetration these slugs deliver. Being just a overgrown 22 LR bullet, they have the same tendency to perentate well. I use a old Morrel crossbow target for a pellet trap at my 36 yard range. If I shoot pellets at it, it stops them quickly, if I shoot 400 grain + bullets at 800+ velecity and put bullets into the same hole or close, it will shoot thru the target. With the 25 shooting under 3/4 of an inch, I hear them bouncing off the Doug Firs beyond.
LIke I say, they are just damn hard to chamber without lube, and seem to suffer from leading without lube. If I spray with Moly and then put them in a bag with Breakfree, I get pretty good results and due to the fact they slide into the chamber easier, I get less flyers.
When I get fouling, 2 or 3 shots with Kings cleans if out. So like I say I am still waiting for the dies.
I used to swage 452 paper patch bullets and 22 jacketed bullets with the Corbin dies, using fired rim fire hulls for the .224 jackets. I made cores with either a 4 cavity mold or out of lead wire for the 22’s. For the 452 PP bullets, I used reject 320 grain 44 mag cast bullets, they worked great.
This mold would probably make a good core mold for a swage project, but maybe not, unless sized down first with a 243 sizer die for easier swaging.
So to sum it up, I am hoping once I get the sizing dies, I will start with Moly and then go to a BlackPowder type lube, not for powder fouling but for flow consistancy.
Marvin has this project all figured out, he sizes the bullets and he lubes with Moly, so I will follow his lead for the first experiment.
Regards,
Roachcreek
Roachcreek,
What lube did you decide to use and are you still using the 40-1 alloy? Everytime I have used moly in the past with any cast bullets it didn’t help. I have also tried the Johnson wax and went back to LBT lube and black powder lubes. In a earlier post you said that you were going to try filling the lube ring with lube..did you try this?
I swage also and would really like to try swaging the 25 but casting is a whole lot cheaper due to swaging die prices. I have a swaging press but this bullet could possibly be swaged using a regular reloading press if CH would make the dies. I may check into this.
I use #4 buckshot on them too but most of the time a 22-250. We get a lot of running shots. I use a woodpecker mojo with a spinning wing and they seem to love it.
Secoda,
On the Handloader site, you enter the bullet diameter and weight and it gives you the BC.
I used to load 33 #4 buck into a 2 3/4 inch hull over a lot of Blue dot, we used to call them black holes, for coyotes. Killed one at 60 yards that came in and set down facing me with it once.
Of course I was selling the pelts, and a shotgun does not rip them, so you just pushed the fur back out the little holes and called it good.
I used #4 buck which is 24 calibet, because even tho you would kill the coyote, unless you broke bones, he would run off to parts unknown and die outside the realm of my wallet.
Regards,
Roachcreek
Secoda,
On the Handloader site, you enter the bullet diameter and weight and it gives you the BC.
I used to load 33 #4 buck into a 2 3/4 inch hull over a lot of Blue dot, we used to call them black holes, for coyotes. Killed one at 60 yards that came in and set down facing me with it once.
Of course I was selling the pelts, and a shotgun does not rip them, so you just pushed the fur back out the little holes and called it good.
I used #4 buck which is 24 calibet, because even tho you would kill the coyote, unless you broke bones, he would run off to parts unknown and die outside the realm of my wallet.
Regards,
Roachcreek
I have two of the Hawke tacticals and they are great with the Chairgun and BRC. THe drop still gets a little unwieldly beyond 150 yards or so but a rangefinder sure helps. How did you get the BC of .114? Our woods and hills are so thick that a shot beyond 120 yards on a yote is rare and I call them in with a FoxPro and mojo pretty close. Actually most of the time I could use a shotgun. I have missed two shots so far because they were running with the 6-ring slugs. I just want to see what one will do.
RC you are right about a over grown LR 22. The LR high velocity flies at about the same speed as well through the barrel and air as well . I have pulled about 450 pounds of high velocity RF lead out of our indoor range . After remelting it down it came in at 10 bhn. And it had a lot of molly coat to burn off as well . Here is a picture of a piece of it before the melt. Note how dark it is . That is the molly lube that was on the bullets . Marvin
RC,
Sorry, we can’t go steady as we both have good women by our sides…but that shot of you in the tub is an all time classic worthy of AVATAR status! And besides, I have always admired you, seriously!
Joe
p.s. Killer house by the way!!!
80,
Does this mean were going steady?
I built that house around that bathtub by the way, it was a hot tub that I had cast without the vents. It is big enough that two adults can get into it and not touch, but that was never the idea. 😀
When your in it your facing a bank of window 14 feet high, lovely effect during a blizzard outside. I have made a ‘clean breast of things in that tub’ with a myriad of lovely women.
Now about the cast bullet. It is simply a slightly overgrown 22 lr if you look at closely.
But your praise needs to be directed Marvin on this, I perhaps just wrote a bit more on it.
Regards,
Roachcreek
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Try it.
resizing and bullet lube.