Short Matadors R3
For those who wants EDgun Lelay but cannot get it for a long time. Pay attention to Matador R3 short version, caliber .22. That is only 680 mm long (Lelya 540 mm long), barrel 420 mm (lelya 300 mm), has the same characteristics as normal size or long Matadors (the optimal JSB heavy speed is 890 f/sec), more shots, accurate as any of Matadors, new trigger, very soft and smooth. Besides I will have someday KITs for turning single shot Matadors into multyshot ones but don’t have any plans to make such a KIT for Lelya. Tony has some available to sell in US now.
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Ed – believe the Lelya is rated at slightly lower muzzle velocity than Matador. I have wondered if the velocity in Lelya is limited by barrel length or if it is compromise / trade off for increasing number of shots. Obviously Lelya has smaller air supply so number of shots will be less – this much is obvious.
I have wondered how short barrel length must be before it starts to materially reduce velocity. I imagine relationship between barrel length and velocity is an S shapped curve – limited return on lengths over some value, but dramatic reduction at some point. However, I have no desire to ruin a barrel to obtain the data.
I got my edgun short today. Really well packed, (thanks Tony) No chance to sight it in yet. Bolt has very smooth, progressive feel to it. Dont know why but was expecting operation to be rougher. Trigger is soft, with a lot of overtravel. It will take a little practice to get used to it. Cant wait for a chance to pester a few targets tomorrow. Older I get the more I like compact weapons. If its not raining tomorrow I will run it on the chrono and see how close to 890 it is.
I will be watching closely. I’m really interested in the short .22 cal. I know this is subjective, but how loud do you think it is?
On the website, it says it gets 60 full power shots which is great for a short package. I’m so close to pulling the trigger on a short Matador ever since I heard that Tony has them in stock.
I have a standard cricket which is a short 27 inches. It is shooting great but it is louder than I expected. I ordered a carbon fiber LDC from Neil Clague to replace the stock unit. It will be 5 inches longer and I expect it to make the cricket very, very quiet.
thanks,
Gabe G.
I have heard this before and believe its true. The shorter the barrel (consistent with achieving velocity) the better. Concept is reflected in the design of 10m olympic rifles. Rifled portion of barrel is short – with a shroud extension to get sight radius.
I got my edgun short today. Really well packed, (thanks Tony) No chance to sight it in yet. Bolt has very smooth, progressive feel to it. Dont know why but was expecting operation to be rougher. Trigger is soft, with a lot of overtravel. It will take a little practice to get used to it. Cant wait for a chance to pester a few targets tomorrow. Older I get the more I like compact weapons. If its not raining tomorrow I will run it on the chrono and see how close to 890 it is.
What Ed is saying holds true for any air gun.
If a barrel is long enough to impart the proper velocity and spin for a given pellet, additional inches of barrel will not necessarily help the pellet do any better.
From my experience the larger caliber the pellet (17-25) the better accuracy at longer distances is with shorter barrels. The main problem being the heavier the pellet gets for the given caliber the more barrel you need to get things up to speed.
Chances are if you can get a 18 grain 22 pellet up to it’s best velocity it doesn’t make much difference if the barrel is 14″, 18″ or 24″ if you isolate the rifle from the shooter and vibration from the barrel…
Yet. With longer barrels things like lock time become critical. The longer the lock time and the longer the barrel the more the shooter and the barrel resonance can impart their inaccuracy.
I added a chunk of rubber to the end of my 24″ barrel and it helped quite a bit. This particular rifle I did it to has a long lock time when compared to others in it’s user group. Some folks say it makes it inaccurate yet I can consistently outshoot them with their faster lock time rifles. Sometimes things like that don’t matter if the shooter can do their part as best as possible.
I’m a believer of longer barrels are better but I see time after time shorter barrels getting amazing accuracy at long distances.
Upside is resale is good for bullpups right now. Breaking even is not a problem if it isn’t everything you wanted. 😉
Well?
Shorter barrel has less rezonation then the long one. That is the key. That is why it is much easier to have good accuracy using standard or short then long one.
Tony will have the CC b4 3 pm tomorrow guaranteed. 🙂 I should see it next week. He had some extra .22s as well.
You know I am really enjoying the SR Pro reticle on the Hawke Sidewinder 8-32×56 on the Cricket. I may need another.
Lets see the divorce papers will be served… Actually I also had a bit of last years bonus still sitting there in my slush fund so I was in real good shape and my wife wants another ring – LOL. Deal with the Devil is an understatement. 👿
Ah, the proverbial deal with the devil… 😆
How does the saying go, easier to ask forgiveness later than to be denied permission? 😕 😆
I can never get it right. 😉
If I do this I owe my soul to my wife. She will make me suffer for it despite my $16k bonus I just got. Wives are awful creatures. I considered the .25 Cricket first and didn’t want to wait for an Edgun. I was torn between the long and std of either. This changes the parameters.
😀
Uh oh, SECoda I see a EdGun 25 Standard in your future! 😆
You know you want it.
You know it.
You can’t resist, call Tony NOW. 😆
Ask Tony, I’ve send him more standards .25 then he ordered.
I was just teasing a bit. For me the std length/weight is about right. The longs are a bit too long for my indoor/outdoor bench rest pesting (the barrel hits the door 😀 ). The accuracy of all of these guns are very very good.
Are there extra std .25s? 😎 I already have a .22 std Cricket.
Just a simple thing — the longer barrel is, the more time the pellet is in the barrel (taking into consideration quite a small speed of the pellets, which one can see by his eye in the scope), the more effects from the shooter (microshakes etc). That is one thing, but if we think about the waves in the barrel and the way they are spreading out you can find many interesting things.
I wouldn’t read too much into it other than Ed is trying to move some standards.
“Ted In Madison”‘s long .25 shaded his standard in accuracy.
Likely the accuracy potential is going to go to which ever is tuned best to the velocity range of the pellet being shot.
Ed – This is the first time I have heard of this. Do you see a group size expansion at say 50m from say std to long .25? So folks reviewing the guns comparatively like “Ted In Madison” may find that the std is more accurate than the long? So the main/only advantage of the long is power and shot count?
Shorter barrel has less rezonation then the long one. That is the key. That is why it is much easier to have good accuracy using standard or short then long one.
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Gabe G.
Just sighted it in and this question turns out to be a little tricky. Subjective to me “shooter” it seems to have more sound than I thought at first. However, I dont think a bystander will necessarily see it that way. Puzzling – right. There is a pneumatic pressure relief type sound, believe source is the shroud pressure relief holes that are very close to the shooter forward hand – right next to the forward picatinny rail support. Being closer to my ear they sound much louder to me than the same sound would if it exited the muzzle – like it would in any of my other rifles. There is a spring sound that is pretty loud – probably because my check weld is right on the action. Bone conduction might be at play. Could be the hammer but seems to occur fractionally after the pneumatic sound – so my thought is the regulator is the source. In any event, these are not sounds that anyone would confuse with gun fire. I need to witness someone else firing the rifle to give my final impression.
Liking the trigger better than I expected based on 2 shots in the dark last night. There is a very soft first stage. Take this up and you are at the second stage. A bit more pressure and shot is on the way. I like 2 stage triggers and this one is pretty good and exceptional given the levers and such that are in the bullpup design. Over travel is not the issue I was concerned about because trigger resistance does not noticeably collapse after it breaks, sure if you apply more pressure it will move. This simply is not an issue to me. Its on the light side for people accustomed to corporate lawyer approved hunting triggers.
Ran a couple shots across the chrono 882 and 888 FPS so right in the ball park.
For sure the rail is biased for long range shooting. I have a SS 10×42 scope in quick release rings that had previously been zeroed in on my 22. My first shot was off the paper high. I had to almost bottom out my adjustment on the scope to zero at 30 yards. Between mildots and internal adjustment this rig will be able to handle range like you would not believe.