WTF happened JSB ??
I´ve now read numerous posts about the current state of the JSB pellets in different Forums around the Globe and the consensus seems to be the same regardless the country : Newer batches of JSB suck! It seems to hold true regardless the caliber and i know that my 18gr Heavies were getting worse but i also thought the sub-par quality isn´t as much of a concern in bigger calibers. I was very wrong…
I opened two new tins of JSB King´s and two new tins of FX pellets,which are made by JSB but are a subject for an extra QC – exactly like AA & EdGun pellets are supposed to be. Those two tins of JSB´s included at least 30% of pellets with visible damage or deform on them. I didn´t even need to check them closely or anything to see deformed skirts etc. Not so with the FX pellets.
This made me want to check how much better/worse the FX pellets would perform right out of the box. I didn´t sort them or checked them BUT i did that with the JSB´s and removed those pellets that had damage on them that could easily be seen. I had to throw away at least 100 pellets from a 350 tin… Not good!
Well – i did some testing and the FX´s outshot the JSB every time. I tested them at 50m/55 yards in 10 shot groupings since that gives much better picture of the accuracy than 3-5 “lucky” shots. The difference was huge ! You can´t see it in these pics really due the awkward angle but those FX´s shot much smaller groups the smallest being 8mm C/C while the smallest JSB group was around 11.5mm C/C.
I didn´t have the best possible weather due the winds and a bit rain but this gives you a clear picture of what´s going on …
The groups on the left were those with JSB´s and those on your right were shot with FX´s. The last FX group got a flier that was caused due operator error and has nothing to do with the pellets. So does the middle one and if it wasn´t for that one damned shout out of that group it woulda,coulda,shoulda been the best 10 shot group i´ve ever shot with an air-rifle at 50 meters.
All the shooting was done using Bipods (GB Atlas clones,of course) and without a bag under a rear stock. Like said that´s where i keep my left forearm. I don´t like no bags there … 😆
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….. EXCELLENT GROUPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!….
Most people think I am NUTS!!!! I just get frustrated when I know that my Gun Scope Combo is top of the line.. but you get a new tin of pellets and your world goes to shit!
I spent years learning to shoot SUB-MOA Groups out to a 1000 yards.. and then pushed the limit to 1760 yrds and 2000 yards. Let me say every little detail shows up..
The fun part is I can be just a frustrated shooting Pellet guns a 25-50 and 100 yards… for WAY LESS MONEY…. 😯 hahahahaha
Mark
I wish I could share more my friend, to be honest they think Im nuts now too and now Ive even been called biased.. 
We are obviously carved from the same stone.. I too started on the 1000 yard line so pushing a 200 Meter shot with an airgun only comes natural to me..
I dont think the airgun world is ready for all this to be honest, the modern guns have by far surpass the pellet technology and there is a lot of catching up to do with lead design etc..
There is a big blank page in my .25cal long range book because Im waiting for JSB to sort there shit out and give us some decent high B.C .25 lead to deal with..
I don’t believe we have reached a benchmark.. I think I have pushed the .177 and .22 cal to its absolute extreme capabilities of both rifle and pellet but I think there’s room to experiment with longer shots with the humble .25 cal.
The 25.4gr Kings have the same BC as the 18.13gr .22 pellets so there’s not much room to play with those.. the market is ready for a better .25 cal pellet, JSB NEED to release a 35-36gr heavy version of their .25cal Kings with the same shape and weight distribution as the 8.44gr .177 and 18.13gr .22cal pellet to raise the B.C.
I know Ed will come to the party with a new barrel/twist rate that will get the best from such a pellet and have a power plant to push them past 900fps which would open up a whole new world of long range PCP varminting for me and many others..
Ed, JSB… are you hearing me?? 😉
Wingman.. thank you for all you data!!!
….. EXCELLENT GROUPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!….
Most people think I am NUTS!!!! I just get frustrated when I know that my Gun Scope Combo is top of the line.. but you get a new tin of pellets and your world goes to shit!
I spent years learning to shoot SUB-MOA Groups out to a 1000 yards.. and then pushed the limit to 1760 yrds and 2000 yards. Let me say every little detail shows up..
The fun part is I can be just a frustrated shooting Pellet guns a 25-50 and 100 yards… for WAY LESS MONEY…. 😯 hahahahaha
Mark
Thank you for backing up what I have said… this is no B S guys.. the accuracy is there for the taking but you need the gear to be able to measure pellets accurately. JSB are not going to do this for you.
Well done on the Air gauge! :8:
All of my rifles have achieved this same accuracy you have demonstrated since I learned this method of pellets sizing for your bore.
These are 10 shot groups from a single fill from my R3 at 50 meters on a still day. Pellets were all weighed and sorted for head sized..
This is a 10 shot group at 100 meters on the same day.. 😀
OK…I gotta share…
You guys have confirmed what I have been working on for the last year…. The Search for the “Perfect Pellet”… I did not want to believe it.. But the Facts have forced my hand. JSB’s production process and material supply vary A LOT…
BUT !!!!! First put the whole thing into perspective !!!!
0.01 mm = 0.00039 inches. And just as a reference …. A standard sheet of copy paper is 0.003 inches. Soooooooo. JSB is trying to control a tolerance 10 times thinner then the thickness of a piece of paper 😯 😯 :shock:… THAT IS IMPRESSIVE for something that retails for 3 cents each (approx $15.00 / 500)
Well…. Cant EVERY ONE MEASURE 3.9/10000 of in inch ?????
OK… so the lead is very soft… and I don’t care how delicate you are it is gonna dent the pellet. I have some back ground in Pressure/mass flow metrology . The only thing I could think of was a “RING GAGE” (use google it will tell you the rest)… I was talking with a friend … and we talked about various “AIR Gaging” techniques.
So long story short… I have made a prototype “AIR Gage” for measuring Pellets…..(and before anyone gives me a bunch of crap… yes I know another very well known Airgunner has done the same thing….Yup Great minds think alike.)
In a nut shell it gives you the ability to measure / compare pellets with a potential difference of 0.005mm (YES.. 5/1000 of a mm) a good “Air Gage” can do way better then the thing I made in my shop!
Step 1 .. Machine a pellet to 5.50 mm (or close enough)
Step 2 ..Buy SUPER Expensive Digital Micrometer to check your work
Step 3.. Make “AIR GAGE” to measure / compare head size to an equivalent pressure.
Step 4 .. Calibrate Pressure Gage System to measure / compare pellets
Step 5 .. Shoot Best groups ever.. (MB500 .. 5 shot group at 25 yards)
Step 6 .. Shoot More groups … (BM500 6 shots at 100 METERS)
Compare Amazing Group to a Dime… I know I was impressed….. Who says sorting pellets doesn’t make a difference
Ok.. don’t want to get ahead of my self. But I have MEASURED / Compared Dozens of tins of pellets.. OLD Black/Gray tins.. New Red and Black…various labeled head sizes 5.51..5.52..5.53..and even very rare 5.54… THE NUMBER ON THE TIN DON’T MEAN “SQUAT”!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
… more to follow..and by the way .. I can measure / compare approx 500 pellets an hour with out damaging the pellets… doesn’t sound like much.. but that is rock’n
Mark
Check this BS out.
AA Heavies (reboxed JSB pellets). Bought 16 tins, two tins were like the pellet on the left. I have found the weight of the AA & JSB pellets to be all over the map, from 10.20-10.50, they are supposed to be 10.34, I even bought a scale that was accurate to 0.02grains.
Somehow I need to get my hands on a way to accurately measure head sizes quickly. It took forever to just weight out 50 pellets.
PS stop making fun of my package 😳
Donny Donny Donny you confused little Mexican cowboy..
My write up was on the R3M not the R3 and was to explain that the two actions can not be compared as they are very different animals. What fix do you speak of? I just demonstrated how to lube your action with moly to prevent premature wear and aid a smoother cocking sensation.
What’s up Wingman! Is the cocking on the R3M just as hard as it is on the R3? I saw your fix for the R3 wondering if I’ll have to do that on the R3M.
PS stop making fun of my package 😳
since JSB company have produced the new size, what to do now?
H 😯 😯 T; JSB will not produce their own JSB pellets henceforth?
you missunderstand me my kalash wearing brother Hemn..
Jsb still make the 5.50mm pellets they are just randomly marked with 5.52mm stickers..
You first need to determine what head size YOUR rifle prefers before looking for a batch to suit..
just because my edgun likes 5.50mm it doesnt mean yours will..
My new R3m hates 5.50mm and will only shoot 5.52-5.53mm well.. They are all inderviduals..
since JSB company have produced the new size, what to do now?
H 😯 😯 T; JSB will not produce their own JSB pellets henceforth?
you missunderstand me my kalash wearing brother Hemn..
Jsb still make the 5.50mm pellets they are just randomly marked with 5.52mm stickers..
You first need to determine what head size YOUR rifle prefers before looking for a batch to suit..
just because my edgun likes 5.50mm it doesnt mean yours will..
My new R3m hates 5.50mm and will only shoot 5.52-5.53mm well.. They are all inderviduals..
Moreover – this is not an isolated thing with just this particular batch/shipment but a known fact for quite a long time from many different shooters that have used all three : JSB,AA & FX.
like I said in the first post.. no I cant explain the damage.. I can say however that with the smaller pellet orders I have done from Jsb I have paid extra for good packing and air freighted them.. I have yet to see this skirt damage in any of the batches Ive imported. Maybe it is cause buy sea shipping larger order which are in transit for months rather than a few days? Again I cant answer that one..
If I was to share everything I had learned from being a retailer of some of these companies it could be damaging to their business..
I can however off help to make the best of an average situation as I am also a customer in these business relationships and have to deal with the same sub standard products you do… its all about education and finding the best product for your needs.
So, guys, where can we get the old silver JSB model? the head size 5.5?
since JSB company have produced the new size, what to do now?
H 😯 😯 T; JSB will not produce their own JSB pellets henceforth?
That still doesn´t explain the plethora of damaged pellets in every tin. FX tins are exact same tins with FX label on them. They both come from the JSB factory in Czech Republic AND both make the same trip to Sweden. How come the JSB´s are damaged while the FX´s aren´t IF this is a transport issue ?? Are you “in the know” about that ?? 😎
Moreover – this is not an isolated thing with just this particular batch/shipment but a known fact for quite a long time from many different shooters that have used all three : JSB,AA & FX.
Jsb are well aware of this.. I have spoken with them myself on many occasions.. unfortunatly it comes down more to the retailer who orders them no knowing what they are selling and educating the customer. It would be near impossible for even the retailer in the know (like myself) to stock every posible head size when JSB dont mark their tin correctly. There is also tha fact that many people dont even know that head size will determin accuracy in any given barrel. Because of this some people try Jsb pellets and only sample one tin which may not shoot in their rifle and then cast them aside going on to other brands thinking their rifle doesnt shoot JSB pelets or worse the it used to shoot them but when they bought a new tin accuracy turns to shit… therefore starting threads like this one.. eg whats happned with JSB pellets..
Like I said this i not a new thing.. JSB have aways been this way. If you are an accuracy nut like myself you will purchase the head measuring equipment needed to determin the size your barrel likes and play the hit and miss game of lucky dip on pellet batches untill you find the head size you need. Until Jsb change their labeling meathod this is what we are stuck with.
Maybe if enough people emailed them with the same request the would look at it?
I know they are aware that head size corisponds to accuracy in a given barrel as they also offer test tins containing multiple head sizes.. I have however never measured this selection to see if they are labeled correctly..
Why don´t we e-mail them ? A collective e-mail from a Forum like this should wake up any nonchalant Czech – or atleast be a reason big enough to reply with some kinda poor excuse.
If they have been informed or not they obviously could care less.
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No, I believe Ed had his labels designed for JSB before his .25 cal Matador came about so they are not available from JSB. I have however had a limited number of boxes made so I am not selling JSB pellets in competition with our NZ JSB agent.. 😉