.25 slugs
On the yellow forum in the classified section there is a guy selling .25 slugs 73 grain and 56 grain. my question is how fast do you think that we could push them down the barrel of a Condor. he tested them in a Sumatra carbine. I would post the link but I dont know how. The wife is in France 🙁 and took the brains with her. 😳
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You beat me to it! Yes, there are some new developments and I think you guys with hot Condors will be very pleased! I went out shooting with Gary today, uh yesterday (I see its late) and we tested the Generation 2 version of the slugs and I brought the new mold home.
I don’t have all the pictures from Gary and our friend Jim yet so I can’t do a proper post right now. I can tell you that at 50 yards Gary put 3 of the 9 ring slugs into a single hole that can’t be more than a .25″ c-t-c group. That was extraordinary of course but it was clear that if the shooter has a good gun and can do his part, these slugs will be excellent hunting (or blowing stuff up) rounds. I can also tell you that if you can shoot a Kodiak at 1144 FPS then you can shoot one of these 84.6gr 9 ring slugs at 821 FPS and it will blow right through a 2×8 at 100 yards.
I’ll prepare a proper post with all the numbers and pictures as soon as I can. I think folks are going to like these slugs even better.
Just wanted to give this thread a bump for those newer members who may not have seen it yet.
Also, are there any new developments, test, etc since the last post?
Jerry told me that the current generation of slugs were difficult to cleanly cast, due to the bottom narrow ring. I made a slight design alteration and cut a new mold for myself to test. Shooting one of my carbines at the velocities you’ve discussed, I got these results today.
Hope it’s of interest. I realize it’s not a Condor, but the slugs were designed for the Condor’s needs. So happens, it also fits my rifle.
Never posted a pic here – sorry. I’ll post the pic on the page you’ve been visiting at my site. Give me a few minutes to do that (I planned to post it here). Thanks.
Here’s the link again: http://www.glbarnes.com/color_slugs.html
Gary
Tried some preliminary groups using the 54gr slugs in a gas rammed Kodiak this evening…. Grouped really well at 30 yards, inside a 50c piece. I didnt chrony them at all. 31gr Kodiaks are around 640fps out of that gun so I’d reckon the heavy slugs would drop that down considerably, but was nice to see they’d group well.
I dont know that I’d shoot them out of a springer, being as heavy as they are, but a rammed gun would be ok. Made a satisfying thunk when they hit.
You have been keeping it about the performance of the slugs. Nowhere on the internet will you get a more enthusiastic discussion on these heavy .25 slugs than right here on this forum. These are the slugs we have been demanding for awhile now. The few other powerful .25 airguns other than the AirForce guns are not gathered together in one place to discuss them like we are here.
Yes that slug is at the top of my short list of experminetal fur rounds. As for Gary’s test using 1/4 inch pine boards, I have seen hunters use lesser criteria for a short-range deer load! Very impressive results.
So I am very excited about trying them, and must definitely get a .25 by the fall.
Jerry and Gary,
We enjoy all you have to bring here for the big bore stuff. Post findings and opinions freely.
We appreciate how you have been keeping the business end to PM’s and Emails.
We have a few rules here and they can be found in the General section of the forum.
Post freely and hope you can hang with this rowdy bunch.
Butcher,
Since you replied to me and not to Gary, I’ll assume you’re a clever fellow who figured out that I’m the guy responsible for Gary not wanting to step on any toes here. You got me.
I was a little concerened that folks might think we were trying to turn this site into private ad space. I don’t want anyone to think that Gary or I are just hawking wares regardless of performance. Maybe I’ve been a little too cautious but since I don’t actually have a .25 Condor to test with, I wanted to be certain that folks were getting acceptable performance out of these slugs and I prefer to read their posts about them instead of mine. (I have a Condor but I only have .308 barrel for it)
Gary’s penetration test is really neat though and I think folks ought to follow the link and see the results for themselves. Heavy slugs are just more efficient and do more damage. Obviously, you have to hit to do the damage but the big slug at 804 FPS clearly smashes stuff better than the 30 some grain slug at 1111 FPS. A lot of guys on this post are getting very similar power out of their guns so this is a very valid demonstration of the slugs performance.
Butcher, you mentioned in one post about not having to go for a head shot and something about penetrating a shoulder bone (IIRC). Well, the penetration test shows the 80gr slug going through 40% more wood. Seems to me that a shot on a coyote or nutria ought to be safe to take on center of mass/heart vice trying to hit an eyeball….
The slug/pellet comparison test I ran is posted @
http://www.glbarnes.com/color_slugs.html
Best I could do to give an honest display of the “work” the slugs can do, as compared to familiar quality pellets.
Thanks,
Gary
If it’s appropriate, I can post a link later, or someone else (who better knows the rules) can e-mail me and get it.Gary
Jerry I believe steel toe’d boots are standard footwear on this forum. Thick skin is also highly recommended.
I don’t recall ever seeing anything resembling a rule on here, either. 😀
Reading your comments, regarding “control” experiments, made me do a comparison of my own. Kodiaks vs. the big 80 grain slug at the same psi and power settings. Kodiaks @ 1,111 fps vs. 80 grn. @ 804 fps. I thought that might be close to the numbers you were discussing.
I don’t want to step on any toes here, so I posted the pics of the tests on the same bullet page you may have seen before. (Where the 45 slugs were posted).
If it’s appropriate, I can post a link later, or someone else (who better knows the rules) can e-mail me and get it.
Hope you enjoy. 😉 Thanks,
Gary
Nice post! We’ll have to get those .252’s on the way quick! I really like the demonstartion of power at 50 yards. That’s where the action is for these slugs, big power, big penetration.
Coconuts at 100? Well aren’t we getting cocky? 🙄 If that doesn’t work out, maybe coconut on the edge of the tank? Or maybe right behind a target on the tank. It would be like taking a squirrel that was trying to take cover behind a steel wall… 😆
Thanks for sharing!
Well, here we go… Jerry was kind enough to let me get into the fray and sent me some 55 grain and some 71 grain in 251. I was very pleased with the outcome; however, Lizzy seems to think that while she is very pleased with the added length, she would like her slugs a little fatter. So I promised to get her some 252’s to try. Longer, fatter- if I had a nickel for ever time I’ve heard that… 😯 . In the range that I hunt, the groups were very good. Not quite as small as the Eun Jin 42’s but I believe once I receive the 252’s that will all change. The 55’s were running in the high 800 fps and delivering in the mid 90 in fpe. The 71s- I did a 11 shot string. Started at 829 fps ended at 792 fps. 829 was 109fpe 792was 98 fpe. Now if the fpe does not add up blame Pyramyd Air. I used their program to run the numbers.
Ok, that didn’t work. That is a stock tank 50yards off the back deck. Until now, I have had no luck punching a hole in it at that range but the 71 grain did it like it was going through butter and left a nice dent in the backside. Second shot went in the same hole. The pressure was too much and I threw the third shot to the left. Got some coconuts- going to try them at a hundred when I get more slugs. I haven’t really done a lot of 100 yard shooting but after reading Rob’s post and others heres what I came up with:
These were done on two different days. Wind came up when I was using Jerry’s slugs so it does not look that impressive but lose the wind and get the 252’s and I believe I can match or even improve on the Eun Jins. Going to chronny some at 100 yards. Wish me luck :D. That’s my two cents, for what it’s worth.
I agree, I was looking for a known quantity or a “control” for want of a better word because Rob mentioned he thought others could shoot better groups. I know how well I shoot Kodiak’s or Eun Jins at 100 Yards – Seeing how well Rob shoots them at 100 yards would provide me some additional relevance to your .25 Slugs.
Nice to have you post here – The intricacy of your work never fails to amaze me.
That’s great.
I like the 909’s. Great guns that shoot very well. I recently made a .25 carbine for my wife, and I used the 909 breech design. Simple, straight forward, works very well.
😉
Gary
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Greetings all,
The Gen 2 .25 Barnes slug design was completed and proofed so it is time for an update.
For the Gen 2 design, the observable difference is that the base of the slug is no longer full diameter. The Gen 1 slugs’ base was the last “ring.” For the Gen 2, the base extends slightly below the last ring and is the diameter of the main shaft of the slug. This adds a little mass to any given number of rings but most importantly allows a little easier casting. Other subtle changes to the mold will help getting more consistent slugs.
Yesterday (8/16/08), I went out shooting with Gary and another friend. We were enjoying our guns but we were also out to verify the new slug design and we did a lot of shooting with them. Gary has produced a new .25 for his wife and that gun can be set to achieve low power and be near silent with a moderator or it can be set to achieve very high power. For the testing yesterday it was set to pretty high power to put it in line with some of the Hot Condors guys on this forum have. At the end of the day we cranked it up a little more and saw a peak of 147.7 FPE.
Here are the slugs we looked at:
From left to right: Diana Magnum, Kodiak, Crow Magnum, 6, 7, 8, and 9 ring Barnes.
As you can see, even the 6 ring slug dwarfs the Kodiak. These slugs carry a lot of mass and will carry some serious energy downrange for the guns that can handle them.
We shot a bunch of 9 ring slugs as they were very accurate and we enjoyed the effect they were having on the blocks of 2×6 we had for targets. We also decided to chrony all these slugs to be able to provide you some real world numbers. We figured that if we kept the gun set-up the same for all the slugs and got a base number for the Kodiak, you’d be able to estimate the power and speed you’d see from your gun by comparing to these numbers. For our set-up the Kodiaks went 1144 FPS which is screaming. We all heard the obvious supersonic crack reverberating off the hills around us. There was no doubt that these pellets were going supersonic. The Diana Magnums were just silly, it sounded like we were shooting a high power rifle not an airgun. Fun, but not what most of us are after. Here are the numbers:
Diana Magnum, 20gr, 1289 FPS, 73.8 FPE
Kodiak, 30.7gr, 1144 FPS, 89.2 FPE
Crow Magnum, 26.2gr, 1203 FPS, 84.2 FPE
Barnes 6 ring, 57.6gr, 922.1 FPS, 108.8 FPE (22% higher than the Kodiak)
7 ring, 66.9gr, 893.5 FPS, 118.6 FPE
8 ring, 72.9gr, 861.6 FPS, 120.2 FPE
9 ring, 84.6gr, 816.8 FPS, 125.4 FPE Avg. (the highest measured was 822.8 FPS and 127.2 FPE at the standard set-up)
We probably didn’t spend as much time shooting groups with the .25s as we should have but we were shooting several guns and also enjoying a lot of knock-down targets. That meant we left Gary to verify the accuracy of the various sizes of slugs and we just stepped in to shoot a reactive target now and then. We also can’t shoot as well as Gary can so it’s probably best that we left him with the burden! At least that’s how I see it. 😀
Here’s a picture of a 3 shot group Gary shot with the 9 ring slugs at 50 yards. These 3 were so good we decided to run down and cut the target up for posterity.
Another friend of ours (Bill) dropped by for a visit and decided to try out the .25 and shoot some heavy slugs. He tuned up with some 6 rings and then moved up to the 9s. He thought the 9 ring slugs would drop more so he aimed his first shot higher than he needed to. A nice group considering that!
All day long we were impressed by the energy that the big .25s carried down range. Wood blocks were getting slit and tossed into the air. Late in the day we had a little competition shooting at 100 yards. Gary beat us like dogs of course but what I want to point out is that he used his .25 and a 9 ring slug to do it. Here’s a picture of the back side of a 2×6 after getting hit by a 9 ring slug at 100 yards.
At 100 yards the 9 ring was accurate enough to win our little contest and also strong enough to blow right through an inch and a half of wood. That tells me that we have a serious hunting slug here that will work great on game at airgun ranges.