FrankEdstein Part 2 or Zocoloco & Why He’s Plum Loco!
Below is the thread I quoted from in its exact unedited format. Take a look at the wear and tear on a brand new Edgun R3M breech and mag, then you tell me that’s acceptable. I highly doubt it.
I’ve spent some time in my basement. Don’t know where to start really……
I have had some 50 pellets through now, – and these were my notes:
I started at around 195 bars and used my Crombo for the speed measurements. I noted the pressure after every ten shots, – an it appears my R3M cal.22 consumes some 12/13 bars per 10 shots. I write like a pig, but people with a goood imagination may be able to read the velocity numbers I hope…….. đł Out of the box between 925 and 900 fps with the vast majority around between 910/920.
I used the ms-function with proper indexing, and it never failed once ! It felt a little rough in the beginning, but after a few shots I forgot all about that. It didn’t feel very different from a lot of other guns I have been shooting.
I never removed the mag. It stayed in there all the time. I realized that the mag reveals four open slots as it rotates, – and I simply recharged after every four shots via these. Refreshingly simple as the mag is somewhat hard to pull out. But as it happens, – there’s honestly no need to take it out. Just recharge as I did. It works beautifully……. :8:
Hawkeyes may notice that the mag has been “filed down” quite a bit and gone is anodizing and friends around the edges at the back of the mag. This happens because the mag is being squeezed against the back wall of the mag slot as it rotates. What squeezes it is the spring loaded ball bearing that lines up the mag for each shot:
This ball bearing is a tough little fellow with quite some force behind it. Not only does it push the mag firmly against the back wall of the mag chamber, it also gives the mag some beating as it rotates from one shot position to the next:
You should be able to see how the anodizing is being filed off on the rim of the mag.
There seems to be some grinding going on also around the center of the mag on both sides. Here is the other side of it:
However that’s not the end of the grinding story. I was very surprised to find that the outside surface of the mag also seemed a bit “tired” and “scruffy” after today’s session. Inspection of the mag slot in the breech revealed an edge on the inside that most likely shouldn’t have been there
No big deal as it will be grinded off and polished by the mag during the break-in period……. đ
However, there’s a lot of friction in this mag set up. Some of it will go away eventually, – but not all How to lubricate this part I don’t know yet. Aluminium on aluminium is not easy, and added to that is the risk of getting some lube into the pellet slots and further into the barrel. On that path there’s an O-ring in the forward breech that must be passed too. And O-rings don’t like anything but silicone grease………
I may want to try some silicone spray glider that dries like a thin film on whatever material. It’s designed to reduce the friction of rigging, zippers etc. on a sailboat and should probably do the trick here too……..
My gun is of the MK I type, – and the breech/mag system is already obsolete. As I understand it, the versions shipped to the US is of the MK II variant. I’ve never seen one of those but will soon. Apparently the mags and the indexing system may have been modified a little and for the better. The little nasty ballbearing that pushes the mag against the wall, has been moved inwards towards the center of the mag. That should mean less distance for the mag to rotate against it between shots. It should also mean that the cam that indexes the mag would need less power to do so as it gets a longer “arm” to work with…..
We’ll see…… đ
Oh, – I forgot to tell you how this little bastard shoots. Below is tonight’s session on “paper”. There are five 10 shot groups shot from a sandbag at a distance of 50 m (55yds). The groups should speak for themselves:
Cheers
Trygve in Oslo đ
Hello to all my friends and the ass kissers who wonât see this because they blocked meâŚ
Regarding Edgun R3M: http://www.talonairgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=28318&hilit=frankedstein
For those of you who are not aware of and to recap who exactly are the the Members of the ‘Ed Ass Kissing Club’ or as I like to term them, the self-absorbed, addicted, distracted and ignorant Edgun internet groupies consists of:
Ridetoeat, Coda, the Wing Nut NZ loser, The childish Krille from Sweden, Hoot, The goat screwer, Ed of course, Loco too, Synopsys, Knifemaker, and Iâll update this as I remember the others.
This post is not for the âEdgun Ass Kisser Clubâ members and thank heaven they won’t be responding because they can’t see this thread. I am merely wanting to advise and inform those of you who can think for yourselves and are open-minded enough to see when something is crap and you’re being screwed.
I know many of you have missed me and my accurate, right to the point and amusing posts but we had a very hectic Christmas as business was booming. We finally caught up around the middle of January. I also bought myself a new truck for a Christmas present so Iâve been entertained with that project. Airguns are cheap compared to what you can do to modify a truck today!
The weather is beautiful, 80 degrees this week, life is good, adventurous and fun and I do hope it is for you as well.
Before I get into the actual post, let me make this statement:
Imagine buying a new vehicle and finding out that the drivers door fits too tightly into the frame. Each time you open the door, the paint chips and the door is very hard to open. You then come to the revelation that you don’t need the door because you can enter the vehicle through the window. Now, would that be acceptable? Of course not but the ass-kissing club members, Loco in particular, would have you believe that this is acceptable when owning a $2000 Edgun. And then to add insult to injury, you make this issue aware to everyone and people tell you that it’s acceptable and quit complaining and just use the window to get into the vehicle. Sounds ridiculous, well read on…
I thought Iâd post a long overdue comment that ‘Zocoloco’ made or as I like to call him, just plain ‘Loco’ regarding his beloved Edgun in this thread:
OK, here we goâŚ.
Loco, youâre off your rocker! Do you have your head crammed so far up Edâs butt that you donât see how ridiculous you sound protecting his piece of crap gun!
First asinine statement and I quote:
âI never removed the mag. It stayed in there all the time. [b] I realized that the mag reveals four open slots as it rotates, – and I simply recharged after every four shots via these. Refreshingly simple as the mag is somewhat hard to pull out. But as it happens, – there’s honestly no need to take it out. Just recharge as I did. It works beautifullyâ[/b]
Loco, the gun is designed to remove the mag not refill it each time you see 4 empty slots. If thatâs the case why buy a multi shot! The âmag is somewhat hard to pull outâ is the poor design of the breach and mag itself that you are defending. The thing was designed to fill the mag, load it into the gun, shoot till empty, remove, and replace; not fill after every 4 shots. Incredible statement.
Second asinine statement and I quote:
âHawkeyes may notice that the mag has been “filed down” quite a bit and gone is anodizing and friends around the edges at the back of the mag. This happens because the mag is being squeezed against the back wall of the mag slot as it rotates. What squeezes it is the spring loaded ball bearing that lines up the mag for each shotâ
Loco, âfiled downâ is a satisfactory appearance and function of this flawed model! I own other guns with similar mags and they donât look âfiled downâ. It a design flaw in a $2000 gun.
Third asinine statement and I quote:
âThis ball bearing is a tough little fellow with quite some force behind it. Not only does it push the mag firmly against the back wall of the mag chamber, [b]it also gives the mag some beating as it rotates from one shot position to the nextâ[/b]
Loco, once again this is a design flaw. The gun was designed by an amateur looking to pop out another model to us unsuspecting buyers. Once again, this is a design flaw. I own many other guns with similar mags that operate smoothly without the difficulty this Edgun model presents. And you think that taking a “beating” is an acceptable operating procedure and acceptable design! You are plum loco.
Fourth asinine statement and I quote:
âThere seems to be some grinding going on also around the center of the mag on both sidesâ
Loco, this is an understatement! And you think âgrindingâ on a brand new gun is acceptable and a ingenious design? The gun is flawed as is the design.
Fifth asinine statement and I quote:
âHowever that’s not the end of the grinding story. I was very surprised to find that the outside surface of the mag also seemed a bit “tired” and “scruffy” after today’s session. Inspection of the mag slot in the breech revealed an edge on the inside that most likely shouldn’t have been thereâ
Loco, so now there is a âburrâ on the inside of the breech that âmost likely shouldn’t have been thereâ. Incredible and you donât see anything wrong with that and accept it. Well, I donât! The gun is flawed and should have never been released to the general public until these issues had been resolved.
Sixth asinine statement and I quote:
âNo big deal as it will be grinded off and polished by the mag during the break-in periodâ
Loco, âNo big dealâ huh. Youâre a pinhead to accept mediocrity when paying $2000 for a gun.
Seventh asinine statement and I quote:
âHowever, there’s a lot of friction in this mag set up. Some of it will go away eventually, – but not allâ
Loco, so some of it will go away âeventuallyâ as in when? A month, six months, six years? Is one supposed to suffer through that period with a $2000 gun? And, what is someone to do with the “friction” that does not “go away eventuallyâ as you stated? So we’re just supposed to accept it and pretend it isn’t there because of our love for Ed. You and the others can kiss his ass, I won’t.
Iâm done and want to wish all of you a great week ahead.
All Replies
Hi Veerkracht,
now that we speak about the Netherlands dealer I would like to add something.
It happens that from time to time I come to the Netherlands and when this happens I check if Joost is on site since he is on my route.
You know, just to say hello and also to see his fantastic airguns.
Well I recall that when he showed me the R3M MKI he was asking me “How do you feel it?”, “Do you like how it handles and operates?”.
Well I realized only afterwards that actually he was not pushing the gun even though I could have been a potential buyer. He actually was letting me taking the decision myself, if I would have liked it I could have ordered one but since I was not in buying mood (and didn’t have the budget neither) I just said “Looks nice”.
Only after reading all the posts about the “supposedly or not” R3M MKI problems I understood why he didn’t push the gun and this tells you a lot about what kind of gentleman and honest dealer he is đ .
ATB
Hi Veerkracht,
I’m happy to say that I have the privilege to know personally the Netherlands dealer and he is a very fine person and a REAL GENTLEMAN.
He is always ready to help and his limits are given only by the manufacturer himself.
Not only he is a dealer but he is also one of the foremosts airgun experts and shooters and all his setups are always OVER THE TOP.
Many times he gives advices directly to the vendors on how to improve their products and services.
I just wish they were all like him. đ đ đ
ATB
Here in the Netherlands we have a good dealer of the Edguns.
He stands behind his product with parts and service.
I never had any problems, on the contrary, I’ve been helped even when the dealer did not need to.
Regards, Robert.
Hi,
one thing that you guys will never understand is that when we speak about EDGUNS we are not speaking about normal items but very very special items, I believe we could easily speak about mistic items.
Have you ever heard about “Mass Hypnosis”, “Brainwashing”, “Robotic Zombies” well apparently a lot of people reaches that status when speaking about Edguns and they would do and accept everything for them.
One thing is true, they must be very very special because apparently even the tax authorities of many countries had to classify them as special and particular items and apparently they now set special taxes only on them.
I will make an example. Have you ever heard about those MINOR european airgun vendors like Daystate, FX, Weihrauch, Steyr, Anschuetz, Diana, Haemmerli, etc, etc or even about those MINOR european firearms vendors like Heckler and Koch, Beretta, Sig Sauer, Glock, Manurhin, Benelli, etc, etc, well the products of all those minor considered european manufacturers when exported to the States they cost more in the States than in Europe, you know all those import taxes costs and when import-export is envolved the prices go always higher.
Well the EDGUNS are so special that they escape that principles, the rules have been re-written only for them, Edguns are so special and to my knowledge they are the only items worldwide that when shipped from Europe to Europe they cost more than if exported from europe and shipped to the states and this alone means something. Apparently there are some european mistic taxes that apply only to them and this alone makes those rifles really really special.
I mean with really special and mistic items like those, why should an european customer, that has bought a faulty R3M for an equivalent of only 2680 US dollars complain?
I wish there were some more European MGs but unfortunately apparently all of them are currently “high on trip”.
ATB đ
I’m glad we can agree on that statement. :dito:
You just described your own thread. You bitch and bitch and call people names and offer NOTHING constructive. Look at what RIDETOEAT did, he made new actuators and actually fixed the issue (yes, Ed should have done that). THAT is “constructive”. :thumb:
Blow it wide open then. Why same the old shit post after post. đ
No refunds has been the policy since day one. Does it suck, yes, is it wrong, sure (and I said as much back when when the guns were arriving with broken stocks), but it’s the policy, why do you think you have to pay the way you do⌠đ
I like my EdGun, have not needed to fix it at all, in fact it shoots great (much as your other Edguns shoot right?), would I buy a new one? Nope. No way. Why? For the exact reasons you pointed out.
I had issues with my EdGun so I know where MG is coming from and I agree Ed needs to work out the customer service aspect and ethics of his business strategy or he won’t be able to sustain a competitive advantage. And as for MG’s posts I personally don’t have a problem with them, everybody is here on TAG because there is no censorship and we like being able to say what we think. If you want a more managed/biased/controlled environment go to GTA or Yellow because thats all you get, but then you never really know the issues with certain airguns or what people truly think about a certain vendor, manufacturer or seller because everything you read or look at you have to question affiliation of the poster and what the agenda is. If MG’s posts are truly getting under your skin by all means block his posts from view but don’t bait him and then say oh your blocked I can’t see your posts, that just adds fuel to the fire. Let it run its course and like any wildfire it will die out. So for you MG while every now and then your posts may get repetitive, I WILL NOT BE BLOCKING YOUR POSTS. I may not always agree with everybody but I don’t have to read what they say either (theres a few posters on the yellow that I don’t even check what they have to say anymore). Sorry thats my :2cents: take it or leave it I don’t give a shit.
I have to agree to above Post. And while MG and i have had our great differences i know exactly why MG is pissed at the whole thing. Been there – done that. I didn´t want to return my gun though , just needed to get parts to replace those that literally blew up but that was an ordeal and took four months to get sorted. I also agree that a gun with a price tag like these Puppies have shouldn´t have flaws caused by poor machining, materials and/or assembly. Kinda seems like it´s taking place in a big hurry in low-light environment while sipping Beer – or Vodka . All that coupled with the very poor customer service and parts availability is what keeps me from giving the EdGun a third chance. đ
MG,
Your last post was the best post I have read in a long time. With out the name calling and your fancy abrasive words, I am with you on this. There is no question that you got a POS, and it should have taken care of from the beginning.
It is what it is, situation got out of hand. I hope what we can do is to band together and demand better service, better parts availability, and better email support from his distributor!!!!
If Tony can’t do this, get him out, I can replace him. I know I can’t do worst than the current situation. Bottom line is Ed needs to up the ante and improve his game.
Ed, if you need a new distributor for your Edguns, email me. How much $ do you need to start ? I am all in.
Hey MG, congrats on your new F350. Please tell me that you got the diesel. What size engine does Ford puts in their truck these days? It has been awhile that I have not been update on the Ford trucks, but I have an F250 super duty Diesel 7.3L.
That thing is a monster! I can’t imagine an F350 tricked out truck can do? MG, go got pictures?
John
\
Donny….
the reason that i am not posting and hid ,,,is more than on week my family and i were very sick and i have to take care of them and my job as well,,,, it was really hard to pass this week ,,, Thank for God đ we are well….
regarding MG; i am still say, he has all his right to complain and post his problems but ; in a peace way and he at least could be like brother Trygve, as he paid and wait long time then got old .22cal R3M model with two .25 cal mags, ,,, but his way was very peaceful and gently ,,, result, you should know ,,, he will keep the old R3M breech and will get the new R3M model ,,, he could kill two birds with one stone :biggrinn: :biggrinn: Great man ,,, i liked him always ,,
my dear brother MG ;
please don’t take my words as an offend ,,, there is no difference between all of you for me ,,, you are just my US brothers abroad ,,, these letters are just my fucking 2 cents ,,, if you don’t like them just ignore them and keep going on your way … hope you can fix your problem …
OK, letâs wind this down. I wonât reply to one individual because his 2 posts are just plain sophomoric. Iâd like to reply to everyone but itâs just not possible but thank you for your support. I bought an F350 Platinum for those who asked.
There are just too many Edclub trolls who just have to get involved in a thread they have no business getting involved in as they add nothing constructive to this issue. They have the need to see their name up in lights because they are so self-absorbed and feel the need to pollute this and many other threads by making ignorant statements about nothing in particular.
Those of you who support Tony & Ed through all this are just supporting bad behavior. Youâre giving them the green light that itâs ok to manufacture less than perfect products as we are willing to accept mediocrity. I am not. The next issue may not be just a badly designed breech. Perhaps, next time one of you blows their head off due to a faulty or poorly designed air cylinder. All I know is itâs not going to be me.
Which brings us to the next point. If someone purchases a Daystate, FX, Marauder or Evanix, etc and something major happens where someone truly gets hurt, there is recourse. Iâm certain AOA and Pyramyd as do the manufacturers have deep insurance policies to help cover any medical bills due to a faulty product. Kiddies, youâre on your own with Edguns as I guarantee you Ed certainly carries no insurance and neither does Tony.
Those of you who say you get more bees with honey are absolutely correct. I handled this very delicately until I became outraged at their lack of service to a customer who has spent almost $8k with them and sent many, many new buyers their way.
This whole fiasco is deeper than Iâve let on. When I discovered the R3M I received was a FrankEdstein in that it was flawed, I contacted Tony. I expected him to say, bring the gun back and you can pick a new one or bring the gun back and Iâll refund you in full. What I got was, Iâll refund you minus the stock which was basically $150 off and I keep the stock. That reply and offer were both totally unacceptable. A prompt and cheerful refund in full would have been both appropriate and good business.
First and foremost his offer and attitude are bad business. Secondly, Tony and Ed are both short sighted. I purchased 4 guns from Tony with my first being an R2. I was one of the first buyers of his creations and if that makes me a charter Edclub member then so be it. Iâve been to Tonyâs home on numerous occasions and he has been to mine. There was more to this than just another sale and we conversed on other issues as well. It was a good business relationship or so I thought. I felt like more than just another customer but all I am and all you are is just another dollar to both Tony & Ed.
I can break this wide open but I choose not to or at least not yet. I can make many of the Edclub members look like the fools they are for being Edclub members, staunch supporters and sticking up for Tony and Edâs shady business practices. All I wanted was a refund in full for a faulty product and this would have never been blown out of proportion.
If any of you had this experience I would back you in a heartbeat because itâs just plain, âthe right thing to doâ. To argue with and belittle someone experiencing a faulty product such as I have after spending $2k goes to the exact moral turpitude of many of the Edclub members. It could have easily been one of them.
The product was faulty and should have never been released and perhaps even recalled or the breech recalled and replaced with his newest âsmootherâ model as stated in a current thread. Thereâs the proof he agrees the breech was at least not smooth enough. I don’t even want the gun anymore because it is poorly designed with a bad breech and mags that fit much too snugly causing premature wear and tear on all the parts. The recall is a whole other avenue and conversation.
And to Donny – just to dispel any delusions of grandeur you may have, trust me you are no internet sensation. :rofl:
You would think that’s how this person would be…being that he/she has their edgun already but WRONG!!!…
Yap yap yapping away…instead of shooting….I have proof of my shooting…(rabbit dinner tonight)
Two shout outs in two days UGMJ đ I feel like an internet sensation or something lol. Now that I’ve got my gun, I’ve been spending more time shooting then yapping. I think that’s how it is with all newbies. Same with my counterpart brother Hemn.
But their is a member of the edclub that just kisses ass beyond anyone I’ve seen…and it’s gotten soo annoying that I had to add him đż
Shit I mean people where mad at Donny for talking too much…lol but this guy makes a new thread ever 15 mins cause he feels the need to be seen on the top of the thread list….it just sucks that I still see his name even tho he’s on the ignore list. :angrymob:
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one thing that you guys will never understand is that when we speak about EDGUNS we are not speaking about normal items but very very special items, I believe we could easily speak about mistic items.
Have you ever heard about “Mass Hypnosis”, “Brainwashing”, “Robotic Zombies” well apparently a lot of people reaches that status when speaking about Edguns and they would do and accept everything for them.
One thing is true, they must be very very special because apparently even the tax authorities of many countries had to classify them as special and particular items and apparently they now set special taxes only on them.
I will make an example. Have you ever heard about those MINOR european airgun vendors like Daystate, FX, Weihrauch, Steyr, Anschuetz, Diana, Haemmerli, etc, etc or even about those MINOR european firearms vendors like Heckler and Koch, Beretta, Sig Sauer, Glock, Manurhin, Benelli, etc, etc, well the products of all those minor considered european manufacturers when exported to the States they cost more in the States than in Europe, you now all those import taxes costs and when import-export is envolved the prices go always higher.
Well the EDGUNS are so special that they escape that principles, the rules have been re-written only for them, Edguns are so special and to my knowledge they are the only items worldwide that when shipped from Europe to Europe they cost more than if exported from europe and shipped to the states and this alone means something. There are some mistic taxes that apply only to them and this alone makes those rifles really really special.
I mean with really special and mistic items like those, why should an european customer, that has bought a faulty R3M for only 2680 US dollars complain?
I wish there were some European MGs but unfortunately apparently all of them are currently “high on trip”.
ATB đ
European MG’s ? High on a trip ?? If you mean what’s referred as Club Ed there aren’t so many. If you mean Europeans with negative experience with the EG there’s quite a bunch of them. Just read some UK forums, as an example, and the BP crowd is mostly Cricket these days.
The Dutch EG dealer Joost is indeed a Gentleman and stands behind what he sells.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2. This POS iPhone sucks though …