LOTHAR WALTHER TO OFFER A 9MM BARREL !!! GOOD NEWS!!
I noticed a new entry on the Lothar Walther site.
They will be offering 9MM airgun barrels!!!
READ THE FOLLOWING BACKWARDS these are Emails going back and forth:
Woody:
Thanks for the quick response!!!
How do I get signed up for one of these barrels?
I can announce your intension to offer 9MM airgun barrels on the airgun forums.
The bullet I use has been 105 grain, conical, flat nose.
It is about .5 inch long and hand cast from a lee mold — soft lead.
I can get 1050 FPS (250 foot pounds energy) using this bullet.
The gun / bullet combination is very inaccurate (4 inch groups @ 50 yards).
I am using an Addams & Bennett, $79 , 1 in 15 inch, barrel, 26 inch long –>junk!
I cut the barrel OD from 1.25 inch to .75 inch, as a result there are tight and loose areas in the bore.
I just tested with a 125 grain, conical, flat nose bullet. Lee mold #90238
It is .6 inches long and 135 grains, as cast.
I get 1000 FPS, for 300 foot pounds energy.
This is the bullet I intend to use, as it produces more energy.
As of yet, I have not done accuracy testing, with this bullet.
With airguns, increased barrel length equals more power.
28 inches is better than the 26 I am using now.
$125 sounds good by me!
Again: How soon can I get one of your barrels?
Thanks!!!
Mark
From: Woody lotharwalther@mindspring.com
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 6:09 PM
To: mark
Subject: Re: Message from the US-Webcontact-Form
Mark,
We are setting up production now on 9mm airgun barrels. They should be ready for ordering about late october.
The OD will beprobably 0.700-0.750″ Length is to be 28″.
Twist will be 18-or 20″. (650fps) However, at the velocity you are getting 16″ would be better.
For a single one, you are looking at $125 give or take some. Possibly less depending on quantity.
After these start production, they will be a stock item here.
What sort of projectile do you use. This may affect the design of the barrel.
Sincerely,
Woody
—– Original Message —–
From: marK
To: lotharwalther@mindspring.com
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 5:19 PM
Subject: Message from the US-Webcontact-Form
Message \\\”Other Calibers
Beyond the common calibers for airgun, LOTHAR WALTHER is able to offer you all other calibers for new airgun projects as for example .308, 9mm etc.
Please call us at 770-889-9998 or send us an email.\\\”
I BUILD CUSTOM HIGH POWERED AIR RIFLES.
I AM LOOKING FOR A 9M OR .357 BARREL BLANK.
CM OR SS.
IT MUST BE LONG, 28 TO 32 INCHES.
1 IN 20 RIFLING (OR YOUR RECOMENDATION)
IT WILL SHOOT A 135 GRAIN BULLET @ 1000+ FPS.
STRAIGHT OUTER DIAMETER BETWEEN .625 AND .750 INCH.
CAN YOU BUILD SUCH A BARREL?
HOW MUCH $$??
THANKS
MARK
All Replies
Note left on Brad’s Neighbours doorstep after his Corvette disapears.
“Hi, I just borrowed your car, I left several notes saying I wanted to buy it but you didnt respond… its your own fault for not responding”.
And now your accusing Dennis of stealing Crosmans design? Even if that were true, “Someone else did it” was never a valid excuse when I was in school. No one mentioned it because its irrelavent to this thread as Crosman never made a .308, so what Dennis does in other area’s has nothing to do with the issue at hand.
Makes me wonder what would have happened if Sean had of said thanks but no thanks regarding his valve.
Or Selph could have been offered the lot for absolutely nothing but insisted that wasn’t fair and cut a very decent deal. If that had been my valve I’d be very happy with Selph’s conduct in that particular area.
Not answering your emails is not the same as giving permission. In fact, it is clearly not giving permission and you should have respected that even if you felt you were treated rudely.
Oh, don’t bother calling me a DAQ follower or sycophant. Anyone who’s aware of my opinions regarding DAQs is clearly aware that isn’t the case. And even if I were the #1 DAQ fan, it wouldn’t change the fact that you apparently stole his design with the help of LW to offer a competing product.
You and Woody could have easily specified a twist rate, number of grooves and bore/groove dimensions and made a barrel. You would have taken your chances on performance. Instead you took the risk out of the equation by appropriating someone else’s work. Not cool.
You know what ever I say you will just think I am a thief so what ever I really don’t care what you think, for one it is a free world and people will try to improve on a flawed design that is what people do, your acting like I just started to produce the DAQ rifle‘s, I would be real interested if he even has insurance. And how a bought his air tanks I never saw a DOT stamp or did I just miss it. Every one is so concerned a bought there scuba tanks but not the tank on his gun, how stupid do you realize what that would do when it fails can you say bye to your hand to start.
I had to pay for the engineering of the lands and grooves and the custom rifling button not cheep.
He follows another
What is the story with the DAQ guns? A lot of people worship them, but their performance really doesn’t seem up to par with some other custom Big Bores. Not to mention the weird placement of the action in the stock and the Butt-Ugly Trigger guards 🙄
And the lack of any safety I guaranty he doesn’t have liability insurance on anything he makes, just weight when they start to fail and people get hurt, then he will wish he never heard of the Department Of Transportation especially when they come for him for producing an illegal canester and shipping it across state lines.
My insurance company asked me exactly what I was looking to manufacture and If my air tanks would meet DOT guidelines Denis has no idea how to even test hi cylinders check the pics below first one the proper way and second the DAQ way.
Question how is he testing the expansion of his tank?????????
The fact is DAQ is limited in his out put and so others are trying to fill the void and make sales to those who can not get a DAQ.
I checked out is site . You’re right WOK, excellent price point from the mfr and inflated price from the resellers. Nevermind my stupid comment about the value. Even if they were $1700 new, it no worse than a Rapid 😛
We went over this before I recall. You buy a DAQ to reverse engineer it and then decide its crap and so that clears your conscience.
I posted because I figured you of all people calling Woody on a dishonorable move. Find that somewhat amusing for sure.
Don’t gunsmiths have a code or somesuch? I know Electricians do.
Walter…
A spartan big bore airgun from the hands of one man at a good price.
That is the story.
Good price?????? Wait, they sell on the yellow for like $1700? I would say good at 750-1000….. But this isn’t a debate on DAQ guns, it’s about the stealing of a design.
That is not what DAQ sells them for. Go check out his site.
The fact is DAQ is limited in his out put and so others are trying to fill the void and make sales to those who can not get a DAQ.
He follows another
What is the story with the DAQ guns? A lot of people worship them, but their performance really doesn’t seem up to par with some other custom Big Bores. Not to mention the weird placement of the action in the stock and the Butt-Ugly Trigger guards 🙄
A spartan big bore airgun from the hands of one man at a good price.
That is the story.
Good price?????? Wait, they sell on the yellow for like $1700? I would say good at 750-1000….. But this isn’t a debate on DAQ guns, it’s about the stealing of a design.
He follows another
What is the story with the DAQ guns? A lot of people worship them, but their performance really doesn’t seem up to par with some other custom Big Bores. Not to mention the weird placement of the action in the stock and the Butt-Ugly Trigger guards 🙄
A spartan big bore airgun from the hands of one man at a good price.
That is the story.
He follows another
What is the story with the DAQ guns? A lot of people worship them, but their performance really doesn’t seem up to par with some other custom Big Bores. Not to mention the weird placement of the action in the stock and the Butt-Ugly Trigger guards 🙄
Jerry a DAQ follower ?…Hahahahahahahahahahahahah…..deep breath….hahahahahahahaaaa
He follows another
Sorry if you think my post is crap but you’re just plain wrong here. I just so happen to have a .308 Condor with a DAQ barrel. Since he sold the barrel and it is a .308 and it is in a condor, it appears your are competing. Especially since he apparently sells barrels from time to time. And you’re not just competing with a design you came up with that might be better or at least competitive, you’re competing with a design copied from him! Maybe you’re right, you’re not competing here, you’re stealing his business.
Not answering your emails is not the same as giving permission. In fact, it is clearly not giving permission and you should have respected that even if you felt you were treated rudely.
Oh, don’t bother calling me a DAQ follower or sycophant. Anyone who’s aware of my opinions regarding DAQs is clearly aware that isn’t the case. And even if I were the #1 DAQ fan, it wouldn’t change the fact that you apparently stole his design with the help of LW to offer a competing product.
You and Woody could have easily specified a twist rate, number of grooves and bore/groove dimensions and made a barrel. You would have taken your chances on performance. Instead you took the risk out of the equation by appropriating someone else’s work. Not cool.
Not ever having made a barrel i’m a little in the dark.. I do know one needs a center drill, a very long drill bit (gun drill) and a rifling button that is pushed through the bore to cut the riflings.. so out of curosity what specialized tooling did you have to buy that they didnt already have?
And BTW if you had made Blobknobs valve with out his permission you would not be selling them here TAG or on the Yellow Forum. So I doubt it would have been worth your while unless you had the support of this forum or the Yellow Forum
No they were to hold onto the tooling for my next run of barrels Woody just decided to run with the ball so let him. I don’t need to make these conversions, I just thought it would be nice to have a 308 AF gun I am going to keep one for myself and sell of the rest.
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Up to par with what other custom big bores? I’d honestly like to know, as I can indicate the strengths and weaknesses of any you come up with and I don’t know any that are better. You think Barnes maybe? They’re nice guns too. Try finding or affording one though. If I could, sure, I’d be for it, but I wouldn’t give up the DAQs either… I don’t know any easily affordable or available that shoot any better or have any more energy than a DAQ .458 at 500+ FPE. You might do some serious big bore shopping to figure out what I mean.
Where else would you put the action? Six inches forward of it’s current location, to increase the OAL of the gun too? As is, they handle much better than the pictures of them perceive. You’re welcome to give either of mine a whirl. In the past the trigger gaurds were a bent piece of metal, he now mills them and they look better. Several design aspects have been refined over the 13 years that he’s been making air rifles.
It’s a simple design that works. Why does it have to get any more complicated than that? What way is there to build an air rifle without using a valve, hammer, barrel and trigger? In the case of a big bore with few shots, thats all that is required… maybe he should change them up a bit eh… crossblock safety, manometer, threaded fill nipple cover, match grade electronic trigger, iron sight, full length shroud with integrated chronograph, grenade launcher attachment, wookie carvings in the receiver, fully automatic belt fed for 3 shots… now we’re talking! While he’s at it he may as well tinker up the price another $2000.
My insurance company asked me exactly what I was looking to manufacture and If my air tanks would meet DOT guidelines Denis has no idea how to even test hi cylinders check the pics below first one the proper way and second the DAQ way.
[images removed to save space]
Question how is he testing the expansion of his tank?????????
I, for one, could care less if they don’t have a safety. And why should they be insured? I trust in myself to be safe with a gun more than I trust any safety mechanism, and I trust in the maker as to the quality of the work and materials used.
It seems someone is envious that their rifle didn’t pass their insurance agency’s test for production. Funny, considering it was probably another big Crosman, if there ever was such a thing. I haven’t seen any expressions of effort from you to make yours meet the guidelines.
If the rifling is so messed up they must shoot horrible as hell… Why ever would anyone want to use an inaccurate barrel for their own conversions. Obviously must be crap I tell you…
What was your reservoir made from? How did you test it? How reliable was your safety mechanism? What type of valving did it use? How about the trigger? Lets see some pictures of your failed prototype and design.
Perhaps, rather than using hydraulic tubing designed for high pressure for the reservoirs, Dennis should drill his own from aluminum stock with 1/2″ wall thickness… that’ll give three more pounds and the added safety measure you’re so concerned about. Funny I don’t see any air rifle reservoirs leaking or exploding, with the exception of moronic individuals charging their rifles with propane.
It’s about being able to keep demand while keeping customers happy and safe. And also keeping your word. I don’t see a lot of that going on here. Dennis must be doing something right.
I’m sorry that this thread has been hijacked Mark.