1st Rogue in…….NOT GOOD
If you haven’t seen it over on the Yellow, the 1st Rogue experience is not a good one.
I have to say that even today, i am still amazed at how folks will DEFEND a gun that doesn’t shoot well and its manufacturer. Were is the FIGHT in all of us anymore? Everyone is telling the guy to send the gun back to Crosman and Crosman will make it right. Am i the only IDIOT who still beieves in the simple principle that if they don’t get it right the first time then why give them a second one. For 1300-1500 bucks, 25 bucks for 25 bullets, and a shit load of HYPE, if i got results like what that guy got, Crosman would receive a RETURN package from me alright, but my Rogue would not be in it…lol. It just amazes me how folks get crap and all anyone can say is, “they’ll do you right, send it back”. It cost time and money to ship a gun “ONCE PAID FOR” back for repairs or service that it SHOULD NOT NEED in the first place. Trust me, i know that if i DO NOT know how to work on airguns, then i have no choice but to return it but this is simply BULLSHIT.
I guess my attitude comes from having one too many AIRguns that cost a ton of money have issues from the jump. BB guns simply COST waaayyy to fucking much money for what they are and for the problems they have to exist when NEW.
AM I THE ONLY ONE?
All Replies
Steve
Thanx Man. Well, Randy Mitchell had talked about buying one and sending it to about 4-6 different guys that he trusted. He wanted them all to review it and shoot it and report on it then pass it along to the next guy. I WAS SUPPOSED TO BE ONE OF THOSE GUYS..but i have yet to hear anything and honestly, i doubt that i will. It was actually a good idea i though.
Don’t look now Tofaz, but you are an airgun reviewer. What you say about airguns and gear is of great importance to many of us. Thanks for the great videos. We should get a Rogue into your hands…purchased from somewhere that will give a refund if necessary. 😉
“couldn’t hit the ground with a gravity gun”. That’s funny right there. Thanx for that one Jerry.
I agree though, his post or LACK of info really pissed me off. Just don’t think it was thorough, and honestly something IS NOT RIGHT. That post really left me with a serious case of BLUE BALLS for more info. Him not responding really to people that offered him advice was also WEIRD. I’m sorry, for 1300 bucks, i would not have given up so easily. But of course, that’s me.
Maybe i should be a fucking airgun reviewer so i can show folks how to do it. If your gonna mention the GOOD or the BAD, give us a good and thorough info. While saying a gun shot 2″ at 25 yards is INFO, its not good info. There is more to shooting than just 2″ at 25 yards. You gotta be descriptive.
But whatever. I’ll just keep waiting for somebody….ANYBODY…to give us a REAL review of the ROGUE.
Fuckit, i’m going email CHIP
If you have a gun with a shroud that got dislodged because the FEDEX or UPS or USPS guy dropped it 20 feet off a shelf and now it clips, does it matter what you shoot from that gun? We don’t know that isn’t the case because the reviewer never responded that he had checked for clipping!
That’s one of my points.
I’ve helped people on this very site diagnose poor results with the slugs as well as pellets and found that they ultimately had a good gun and that they could get great results, they just had to figure out a problem or learn how to shoot a more powerful gun. Nothing wrong with that, they asked forand acted on advice and walked away shooting good groups.
Jc posted the gun was shit with 4 pellets and that was that. Well, I don’t think that’s enough info. Maybe the gun has been hurt in transit or maybe Jc can’t hit the ground with a gravity gun!
I did see another post from Jc showing off a high dollar gun with a nice silencer on it. Maybe he had great initial luck with that low powered gun and figured it all ought to be the same… I just don’t know because his dump on the rogue says nothing.
Anyone remember that Cyg had a really crappy experience with a Rapid? How about the fact that Ced has a Rapid that is a laser? These guys can shoot and know guns, who’s going to make the call on Rapids being stars or shit?
One, information free post from a guy that doesn’t have a rep for trying everything to eliminate external failure, doesn’t have a rep as a knowledgable gun guy, doesn’t have a rep as a marksman and doesn’t follow-up his slam with facts does not put me on the shit on Crosman bandwagon. Even if I was already on that bandwagon, I wouldn’t claim that post as evidence.
Hell, I hope i’m wrong!!! 😆 😆 😆
I can see the electronic control system trickle down to the lower rifles if it works and works well since a major manufacturer is all set up to produce it!
Imagine a MRod with the electronic control system… 😀
You bring up great points!
I think alot of the reason you see so many post about Crosman is simple, the price of their rifles. They are less then half the cost of most Airrifles out there. So more of the every day people buy them ….. more sold means more possible feed back.
I’m in NO way defending Crosman. I to have seen post after post on Crappy weapons. I do have a .22 Mrod that is a tight grouping rifle, I get good power and it’s quite. Does that make Crosman a hero in my books NO!
I just hate to see one person make a basic statement about some one or something and not back it up better.
As far as the Rouge goes it might be a Zero, I don’t know. But in till some one like you gives me a detailed report, I just can’t pass judgement.
I was told by Crosman the Barrels are made by the same company that made the .25, And I could see a bad barrel here and there make it thru Q&A It happens. Maybe he got a bad one who knows.
As far as the FX and other guns. Simple they make $$$$ dollar rifles and Crosman makes $$ dollar guns. If Crosman took the Rods and made them the quality of a Edgun or Fx or even AF then the Average folks could not afford to buy them.
Now if I never had more then a Crosman 760 and then got a semi good Mrod It’d be like me going from a AF to a Edgun! Some of the people I’ve talked to on the Mrod site had an FX or something in that line then got a Mrod and now all of sudden the Mrod is Crap. It’s human nature to compare and I feel thats were Crosman falls short.
Now if the Rouge comes out in force to be CRAP then yes Crosman will get what they asked for in the end, I mean heck if I bought a rifle for close to the price of an Edgun, Then it should shot close to an Edgun FX or what ever.
I’m just trying to look at all this from both sides. Hell Maybe I’m completely wrong in my thoughts.
TJbryner
TJ,
Yeah anybody who has range duty has experienced that.
I have been going over two issues here and it is difficult for me to seperate them, and when I hear people defending the Rogue or saying there is not enough information I wonder if they are understanding what I am saying.
I feel that Crosmans build quality and practices on the manufacturing of the Rods is going to sour the Rogue, that is the simple gest of what I am saying.
And admittedly we really do not have enough info on the Rogue yet, I just base my opinions on the known quality of the Rods.
And I have read plenty about bad barrels on the Rods to know that it is not the shooter, it is the rifle, and I have seen pictures of bad crowns and have had them described to me to form my own opinion.
The Rogue may end up being a real quality game changer, but Crosman is going to have to change something to make that happen. Right now they produce rifles that are either really good or really bad, and some of the shooters who have gotten bad ones are experienced shooters who own some great guns, that does not make them great shooters, but it givers me a clue they are serious about their guns.
And the fact they have guns they claim shoot really well and the Rods do not, what is going on here TJ?
My questions to you about Crosman quality, is why do we not hear as much shit about FX, AA, AF, Evanix? We hear some stories, but not weekly on the yellow.
Why do we have gunsmiths like Greg Davis working himself into such a hole that people wonder if he is still alive, and Marmont Militia who is staying busy rebarreling these rilfes to get them to shoot.
So do we have gunsmiths rebarreling for FX, AA, AF and Evanix? Yes we do have people rebuilding and tuning Theobens, but they are making great guns into super guns and that is not the same thing. We have popple who tune Evanix rifles, but they did not complain about the accuracy, I can’t remember anyone complain about the accuray of a Evanix or a AA for that matter.
So I have to ask, can you honestly tell me you don’t believe the constant stories coming out about the bad barrels on the various Rods?
Do we have people here weekly asking why their Talons shoot like shit, or asking why their Condors are spraying bullets?
If crosman makes the Rogue in the same quality they are going to have a lot of pissed shooters.
Yeah, this so far is one gun, but based on the rest of the flock I have my opinion.
Regards,
Roachcreek
Well it looks like your speaking straight at me, so..
True I do not own a Rogue and I do not own a MRod or a PRod. I would love to own a PRod, I think it is the cultimation of all the 2240 builds out there, but the simple fact is they don’t shoot consistantly.
As a matter of fact even tho I do not own either model, I feel they just have barrels that are cheap, inconsistantly manufactured peices of shit.
And if you think Crosman does not know this, you have been hiding under a rock like the guy in the Progressive commercial.
Crosman in fact knows this, they are making money off of it and I can come to no other conclusion than they are fucking the air gun public everytime someone buys one that does not work. Sure they will replace the barrel and everyone will kiss their ass and say how good they are in the after market service department, after they put another flawed barrel on the gun, and this happens time and time again.
How often it happens we do not know, for most shooters are not bench resters, they do not post on forums and they shoot tin cans in the back yard. If they realize it is a bad shooting rifle, they pass their new found joy onto the next shooter.
I do not have to own a “Rod” to know this, if we read the yellow we see it every week.
THere is a simple fix on this, stop the flow, hire two guys, one to test fire the “Rods” before they leave the factory, a second to finish leads and crowns that are defective on the barrels. It will raise the price of the guns, but no gun should be shipped that does not shoot correctly, by any manufacturer.
Now as far as the Rogue, I am guessing on the quality of the Rogue, but based on their flagship guns, the Prod and the Mrod, I have to infer that a very complicated rifle will be hard for them to make consistantly with cheap off shore parts of questionable quality.
So when I see the first report, from someone who does not get kickbacks of some sort from Crosman, either in the form of first run free guns on loan or free High Hunts to test them on, I comment on it.
And I will continue to comment on it, I hope it workis for them, I would love to see that technoledgy incorprated in a powerful 25.
But more than that, I would love to see Crosman produce quality products, fully made in America, that I can buy without worrying how they are going to shoot, and shooting accurately is what is important to me, I am a rifleman and accurate rifles are the only guns I own.
But if I had to hedge my bets, it would be that they have made a expensive rifle with questionable Chinese parts cheaply, and the results will make themselves apparent sooner than later.
PB rifles are far more dependable in quality than Airguns, the reason being is the technology on PB’s is primaily in the ammo, and air guns have to manufacturer the power or propellant within the rifle, for that reason alone all airguns should be test fired and screened for problems before being shipped.
So yes I do write about the doubts I have about Crosman being able to pull this off, and yes it is based partly reports and partly on suspicion, and the definition of suspicion is mistrust based on little or no evidence. As far as evidence to me about build quality tho, I think there is ample evidence, whether I have owned one or not.
And thanks for moderating a forum that I can express these opinions.
Regards,
Roachcreek
Nope. I was talking to Sawtime. Because he mentioned me 🙂
I have been around long enough to skim through the posts and not pay to much attention to those who actually do not own it but have a lot to say about it.
When it comes to reviews, opinions and performance testing I wait for actual real time hands on experience.
And to tell you the truth I only skimmed your post directed at me 😀 And read the first sentence and the last sentence…
and your welcome 😀
All I can think of is a day at Ft. Stewart, Ga….
I was a Range Safety and this one soldier couldn’t qualify with the M-16 and after the 3rd time out she claimed it was the weapon. I took it out and shoot expert with that same M-16.
The weapon was a POS but only in the hands of someone who couldn’t shoot.
That’s all I’m saying, Any gun can be a POS if the operator can’t use it to its full potential. I can’t shoot a springer to save my life (god knows I have tried) but I’d never say it was the guns fault.
In this day and age you hear more about the Bad then the good.
If someone got a new EdGun and it shot 3″ groups with four different types of pellets at different speeds i’d be inclined to believe something was wrong with the rifle. Even more so if one of the pellets had been specifically designed for the rifle.
Now if that EdGun came with a test target and it was 1/2″ i’d think differently…
If someone shot a 3″ group with a single type of cheap ass pellets and only tested at one velocity i’d urge them to try other things to see if it they got different results.
Four types of ammo at different velocities with the same results…
Test results parallel the track record of the manufacturer not the best rifle but not the worst rifle… It’s not that it is junk it’s that the price tag demands better than their past performances.
Ok I’m throwing in my 2 cents on this.
If one of the guys on here that I know can shot gave a report like that,I would be inclined to believe. But as far as I know this person couldn’t hit the ground if he shoved the muzzle 6″ deep.
Yes I do own a few Crosman ‘s and yes the track record for them does suck by report. But I’m talking a ton of people with the same issues with the same rifle, Not one guy with very limited information.
If one guy posted that he bought a new Edgun and it shot 3″ groups at 35 yds. we’d all call BS! Right??? Why
Again I feel intill there are a dozen or more reports on the Rouge, it is not right to say it’s junk.
Well that’s my opinion and you know what they say about opinions!
TJBryner
They recalled some of their Rogue, Discovery and MRods?! 😯
Really?
This is news to me!
They have admitted they have issues? (Or should I say, in order to equate it with an auto recall) they were forced through pending lawsuits to recall a vehicle for safety issues…? Vehicles are not recalled based on quality issues. In fact most issues with new cars are passed off to the sucker that bought them and they pay to have those issues fixed at the dealer.
Oh and only a fool would throw their money away on a brand new car.
So i’m to ignore what people think until I actually own the item?
Am I to ignore and discount a good wok butt review?
Am I to ignore a crappy Gamo review? And believe the rifle I get may actually work well?
Come on man! 🙄
Wok,
Well it looks like your speaking straight at me, so..
True I do not own a Rogue and I do not own a MRod or a PRod. I would love to own a PRod, I think it is the cultimation of all the 2240 builds out there, but the simple fact is they don’t shoot consistantly.
As a matter of fact even tho I do not own either model, I feel they just have barrels that are cheap, inconsistantly manufactured peices of shit.
And if you think Crosman does not know this, you have been hiding under a rock like the guy in the Progressive commercial.
Crosman in fact knows this, they are making money off of it and I can come to no other conclusion than they are fucking the air gun public everytime someone buys one that does not work. Sure they will replace the barrel and everyone will kiss their ass and say how good they are in the after market service department, after they put another flawed barrel on the gun, and this happens time and time again.
How often it happens we do not know, for most shooters are not bench resters, they do not post on forums and they shoot tin cans in the back yard. If they realize it is a bad shooting rifle, they pass their new found joy onto the next shooter.
I do not have to own a “Rod” to know this, if we read the yellow we see it every week.
THere is a simple fix on this, stop the flow, hire two guys, one to test fire the “Rods” before they leave the factory, a second to finish leads and crowns that are defective on the barrels. It will raise the price of the guns, but no gun should be shipped that does not shoot correctly, by any manufacturer.
Now as far as the Rogue, I am guessing on the quality of the Rogue, but based on their flagship guns, the Prod and the Mrod, I have to infer that a very complicated rifle will be hard for them to make consistantly with cheap off shore parts of questionable quality.
So when I see the first report, from someone who does not get kickbacks of some sort from Crosman, either in the form of first run free guns on loan or free High Hunts to test them on, I comment on it.
And I will continue to comment on it, I hope it workis for them, I would love to see that technoledgy incorprated in a powerful 25.
But more than that, I would love to see Crosman produce quality products, fully made in America, that I can buy without worrying how they are going to shoot, and shooting accurately is what is important to me, I am a rifleman and accurate rifles are the only guns I own.
But if I had to hedge my bets, it would be that they have made a expensive rifle with questionable Chinese parts cheaply, and the results will make themselves apparent sooner than later.
PB rifles are far more dependable in quality than Airguns, the reason being is the technology on PB’s is primaily in the ammo, and air guns have to manufacturer the power or propellant within the rifle, for that reason alone all airguns should be test fired and screened for problems before being shipped.
So yes I do write about the doubts I have about Crosman being able to pull this off, and yes it is based partly reports and partly on suspicion, and the definition of suspicion is mistrust based on little or no evidence. As far as evidence to me about build quality tho, I think there is ample evidence, whether I have owned one or not.
And thanks for moderating a forum that I can express these opinions.
Regards,
Roachcreek
You’re just telling it as it is 😉
You’re good in my book
By the way where is Mr. WOK ?
Certaintly he would have chimed in on this one 🙄
SAW
My opinion is there is a lot of bitching by people who have never touched one or even seen one in person. 🙄
How many of you drive a vehicle from a manufacturer that does not have a recall each year on something they make? You still drive those vehicles and you still buy from those manufactures don’t you?
Crosman is trying and is taking all the risk. If they did not do something new and try to make innovations the same people would be bitching about Crosman not doing anything new.
The truth is Crosman provides guns for hobbiest to enjoy and they also provide a target for those whose hobby is moaning, groaning and complaining about something they do not own.
🙄
http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/388731/turd-in-a-microwave
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Whose Randy? Is that someone from crosman? That’s who should be sending one to be evaluated…that’s if they believe in their new design and its execution.